Bristol's blessing and political pitfalls

As much as I'm enjoying this overflow of love for Mr. Obama and critique of Ms. Palin, I believe you have the argument wrong as does most of the media. The only one to keep reinforcing the correct argument is Hillary, the one that lost out on the opportunity to run for president, not because of Obama's better experience level, but because of sexism. Anyway, Mrs. Clinton has it right...

The argument about experience should be Obama against McCain.

McCain is the one running for president. How anyone continues to compare the qualifications of Governor Palin against Senator Obama is beyond comprehension. When have any of us seen this? It's ridiculous. And if Obama's experience level was "off the table" before, why is Palin's experience back on? She's running for VP while he's running for President. Keep your One Heartbeat Away argument out for just a second and think about that. Why is it okay for Obama to have "community" experience when running for president, but Palin's Governorship is not enough when being called on as a running mate to a gentleman with an extensive resume in politics. Like him or not, his is who you need to compare Obama's experience level against.

 They will appreciate the Palin family's willingness to make the choice
for life, and Bristol's ability to take responsibility for her actions.

Of course, Sarah Palin doesn't believe that "the choice for life" should exist in the first place.  She believes that no woman should ever have a choice unless their life is at risk.  It's really interesting to see the language of choice used in the statements from the Palin and McCain camps, considering that at all other times they say that they don't believe in the concept of choice.

And it's always frustrating to see the phrase "taking responsibility" only applied to women who choose to have their babies.  Many of us believe that choosing abortion is taking responsibility also. 

The Evil Slut Clique
Evilslutopia ( http://evilslutopia.blogspot.com )

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/02/09/john-mcca...

Bristol should never be attacked.  It is irrelevent.  Sadly McCain really can't be the one to ask for people not to attack the kids of candidates given his comments on Chelsea Clinton's looks (above link).  McCain just gives me the heebie jeebies, as a woman.  He's kind of a reminder of everything that makes little girls grow up to be man haters.  Ewww John McCain.

This 2nd vid is just a really interesting vid on the kind of comments that still get said about women.  I have no idea what any of the people in the video's political preference is.  I think it's just that, at present, when you get into a heated argument with someone it is still pretty acceptable to attack someone viciously for being a woman. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-IrhRSwF9U&eur...

Susan, I have been thinking about that very same thing about Chelsea Clinton. My goodness, what they would have said about Bill, Hillary--and Chelsea--is unimaginable. There would have been no protecting the child in the newspapers. Suddenly we have a poster child for underage sex, and responsibility. The issue here is the double standard that they always manage to come up with, and not Palin's parenting skills.

Laura. www.RebelliousThoughtsofaWoman.com ( http://www.rebelliousthoughtsofawwoman.com/ )

As an Independant who has yet to decide who she wants to vote for  I thought the Lewinksky scandal a bit tacky to say the least.

At the same time I think digging into any family dirt is tacky. With Bristol, the choice was hers and hers alone to have sex at such a young age - unprotected sex at that although two of my kids are solid proof not all contraception works as it should. Her mother didn't make that choice, Bristol did.

I have personally been through this type of scenero with one of my own children and I respect Palin and her family for supporting her daughter's decision to keep the baby and marry the father. As a parent I also know that even the best of parents have kids who make wrong choices... If you never made a wrong decision, where's your halo?

As for the other charge against Palin - abusing her office - that remains to be seen but personally I like the fact that she is gutsy and not afraid to fight for what she believes in. I do hope that she is telling the truth.

 As a country I think we all agree we would like a leader who is morally upright and stable, always makes the right choices, can overcome any type of pressure, etc.

But then we would need to vote in a saint and I'm afraid not many of them are around these days and if you do meet one, he or she is probably locked up in a convent somewhere or feeding the homeless in India.

Oh, and I do read Soujourners regularly, one of my favorite magazines and like the magazine I am very ticked off at Condi Rice as I am very pro Israel.... Not sure where Palin stands on that issue at this point.

JUST MY THOUGHTS - new blog post at http://theopenwindow1.blogspot.com/

AHHHHH!  This is so frustrating!!!  Each side is going to spin this the way they want to- what best suits their side!  What once crucified Hiliary is now the reason to vote for McCain Palin.  Don't vote because she is a woman- Vote because she is a mom and woman!  It is like a cespool of hypocrisy!  I am so sure if, for instance, Chelsea Clinton were to be in Bristol's place the right side would be all over Hillary like stink on shit! 

~Susan                                                                                                                   

http://lilmomthatcould.com/

And she cut property taxes which attracted things like WalMart to Wasilla but also increased sales taxes so that in the end, so she is not a reformer on cutting tax. 

 Also, Alaska is a rich state.  While still challenging, it is easier to get a good approval rating when your constituents are awash in money. 

And most importantly, over 18 million Americans voted to put Obama on the ticket.  His qualifications have been deemed acceptable by that group.  He beat out Hillary Clinton who, impressive on her own, is married to the president who brought America through an impressive economic expansion.  In other words, he beat the Clintons, democratic Royalty.

Obama has proven his ability to debate the best, and yet still bring decision makers (voters) to his way of thinking.  Americans would be lucky to have such a skilled, educated in the law, commander in chief.

Granted, I have never seen Palin debate, or seen her have a chance to unite people.  She has a very short amount of time to demonstrate this skill. 

I think the Republicans themselves have questions about Palin.  I have yet to see anyone say she was the 'best' candidate available for the job.  Tucker Bounds, a republican spokesman for McCain, who is normally a very difficult interview because of his oratory skills was made to look like a rookie by Campbell Brown.  Her question? Name me one decision that Palin made as commander in chief of Alaskan National Guard.  Start watching around 5:10.  The "executive experience" argument is sounding a little hollow. And in the last 15 seconds of the tape Tucker pretty much dismisses the notion that the bottom of the ticket is important. Hmm.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/09/...

Okay, so not painting all liberal women with the same broad brush, but upset at some.  That's fair.

I would imagine that it could also have been said that we shouldn't have pursued Bill Clinton's affair with Monica Lewinsky then.  Because his performance as a husband really didn't apply to his role as President and didn't warrant a  Republican-controlled Congress to ask him about Lewinsky.

I would agree to ending that type of dirt-digging.  Would Republican women agree?

You wrote, "we should all just be so excited that a woman has made it to a Veep nomination for the first time in twenty some years"

Why? That completely refutes the arguments about looking at the positions and accomplishments of the candidates in order to decide.

As I've already written on BlogHer, I'm thrilled for my conservative friends who will support Gov. Palin and in turn McCain because of Palin - that they have someone to consider.

But all of us be excited just that there's a woman?

I don't think so - even as much as I could barely look at the GOP debates because of how older white male it was.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Is probably based on an awful lot of comments and discussions all over the internet about Palin's ability to be VP because of her gender, her beliefs about reproductive rights, (she might get pregnant in office!) and her parenting skills.

If you haven't seen those comments, blog posts or tweets or had those discussions with people - count yourself lucky. I've had them, I understand her point.

~Denise
BlogHer Community Manager

Flamingo House Happenings ( http://www.flamingohouse.net/ )

Well, I AM voting Democratic and I don't think anyone has been more vocal on this site in the last 24 hours than I have in saying the Palin's motherhood is a non-issue.

So, I don't really understand your point here.

I would love to hear all these writers come to Ms. Palin's aid. I wonder what the responses would be if she were a democrat. What would the argument be for her? For her daughter? I'm sure it would be sprinkled with a lot of I Am Woman and a smattering of It's None Of Our Business followed by a bunch of Let's Stick To The Issues. The way these two women are being judged by other women makes me realize that unless a woman fits a particular description, she is not worthy of our support. I'm sure there will be arguments against my statement, but search your heart. What is it that's really upsetting you? That Palin's daughter is pregnant? That Palin is a working mom? That she's intelligent and beautiful? That she just might possibly have what it takes? I don't understand all of these arguments about the choices in her own family life. If she were a democrat, her rise to success would be hailed not jeered. But here we are, dissecting her ever move when we should all just be so excited that a woman has made it to a Veep nomination for the first time in twenty some years. How sad that we all still have so far to go...

 ((And to the woman that thinks that privileged people have it any differently as young mothers, you are greatly uninformed. I suggest you go meet some of those youg ladies. Being afraid of too much responsibility at that age is not bound by any socioeconomic levels.))

As Kathleen Marie points out, please do not put Christians in a box.

I am an Evangelical Christian.  I'm voting for Obama/Biden.   Most of my friends are Christian (some evangelical, some not). We're all voting for Obama/Biden.

Christian Groups like the members of Sojourner's ( http://www.sojo.net/ ) are very strong on Obama/Biden.

The Christian Left ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_left ) is finally gaining traction in the media and is growing stronger every day.  We're been around for a long time (well, since the time of Jesus, actually).  We just haven't been as loud or divisive as the Christian Right, which is a more entertaining for the media to cover.

Obama has 20+ years in public service (11 in elected office)

5+ years of experience in executive positions

12+ years in interpreting and teaching constitutional law

Has traveled to Eastern Europe, the Middle East, Central Asia and Africa as a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

11 years as an attorney working for civil rights and neighborhood economic development

11 years researching, writing and working to pass legislation that affects lives at the state and national level in the areas of health care, security, government transparency, safety, support for veterans, welfare reform, death penalty reform, etc.

I would put forth that Obama's resume, experience and skills as compared to what is required by a member of the Executive Branch of government, either President or Vice President, does make him a better match, yes.

This recent news item:

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin employed a lobbying firm to secure almost $27 million in federal earmarks for a town of 6,700 residents while she was its mayor, according to an analysis by an independent government
watchdog group. 

...isn't doing her reformer characterization any favors either.

Hold it.  Did you just call LIBERALS anti-woman?   Let;'s take a look at the policies of the right and the left when it comes to contraception, abortion, equal pay, the ability to sue one's employer for discrimination, paid maternity leave and health care before we go throwing that stone, please.

"Christians understand that humans are fallible, and they know people in
their own congregations who have dealt with this exact challenge. They
will appreciate the Palin family's willingness to make the choice for
life, and Bristol's ability to take responsibility for her actions."

Wow.  So only liberals are judged.  Or mothers who keep their children and can't afford to support them and end up on welfare.  What bothers me is the assumption that any liberal would make the choice to abort a child with diabilities or an unplanned pregnancy. (Sooooo not true)  All we want is the choice to make the decision for ourselves.

"The fact that the Left thinks religious Christians will abandon

Palin after this betrays the extent to which they totally misunderstand Christians."

Much like the fact that the Right thinks that women will abandon Obama/Biden to vote for a conservative candidate who happens to have a vagina betrays the extent to which they totally misunderstand Liberalism.

Lawyer Mama

http://lawyermama.com

http://momocrats.typepad.com

http://dcmetromoms.com

"Many religious Christians will also view her as deceptive, and many
will see it as throwing her child under the bus, but that is neither
here nor there."

Then why make this ignorant statement at all? As a very strong evangelical Christian I assure you I do not in any way shape or form view Palin as deceptive.

It seems to me that Palin family is a close one and that the family came together to make the decision for Bristols and the babies good. It is hard being a teen Mom but many make wonderful parents, especially when they have strong family support. Of couse the situation is a sad one but it will end joyously.

Also, there are good reasons why many parents do not want public sex education. I have sat in on several classes in our local school and they do not promote abstinance in any way shape or form. As a parent I took the initiate and taught my children sex education myself.

I caution you greatly to not put Christians in a box. Most of us are very aware of what goes on in the world.

On another point you made - Palin's "inability" to take Obama's place ican be made very  clear"? As clear as what? Mud? Palin is more qualified to be president than Obama. Not that is crystal clear. 

http://theopenwindow1.blogspot.com/

You can be for or against a woman's right to choose, but I've yet to meet anyone who is against life. The label Pro Life is meaningless. The other side of the Pro Choice coin is Anti Choice. Or we could come up with a different set altogether.

As I understand it, Sarah Palin is not only against abortion, she is also against birth control and sex education. A little education (or protection) might have saved her daughter from this rapid acceleration into adulthood, but I'm not going to rub her nose in it. We all have our little glass houses (as someone already wrote).

In what way is Palin laughable? More laughable than Obama who spent what - four months as a senator? Obama has less background in a executive position that Palin. Who is laughing now? 

http://theopenwindow1.blogspot.com/

Babz - you crack me up!

laurie
www.notjustaboutcancer.blogspot.com ( http://www.notjustaboutcancer.blogspot.com )

What a brave new world it is when right-wingers, who usually are so rigid with their definitions, now want to have "situational feminism" and "situational privacy."   It's that old glass houses thing shining back on them, and it is driving rightists crazy.  But that is not the Left at work---the Right build their own collosal glass "family values" houses as a way of sneaking into my bedroom with their rules and oppression.  Poor things, they are just so naked and exposed when their furs of righteousness are shed.

Deb

www.debontherocks.com ( http://www.debontherocks.com/ )

blog

www.3smartgirlz.com ( http://www.3smartgirlz.com )

consulting

"I hope that she's self-aware enough if the day comes, because 4 years is a long time, that she would recognize the moment the family's needs are more than her career can handle."

Can I ask whether your husband has made the same decision, for the best interest of his family, that you have?

Is it possible that Palin's husband might make the decision that you've made - for the well-being of your daughter, and your family?

Is it possible that instead of looking at Palin through the lens of our experience, as mothers and women - that we might instead look at her through the lens of our husbands', fathers' and brothers' experiences?

Yes, she's a mother. Yes, she birthed the child. Yes, traditionally she would be the one to sacrifice her career to care for a child who needed her or a family who needed her. But is it required... simply because she is a mom, because she birthed... because she's a woman?

~Denise
BlogHer Community Manager

Flamingo House Happenings ( http://www.flamingohouse.net/ )

He is too arrogant that man. Sometimes people become so arrogant they don't realize until its too late. Trying to be too gutsy and daring and different. Does anyone know about a book called"Queen Bee Wanna Bee?" Well John McCain and his little VP Lady are just that. If they don't create a little drama they don't feel happy. By the way I hear some people on CNN talking about how this woman knows how to talk. For crying out loud! she can't give a proper speech!! She repeats herself continously, she's 44 years old and she sounds like a teenager and you all know I'm telling the truth.

They have a saying "IF YOU TRY TO BE TOO SHARP YOU MIGHT CUT YOURSELF" I believe both Ms.Palin and McCain did just that. He more so than her. He simple got too cocky. Wanting to create all this drama. He's 72 Years Old and I don't care what anyone says about Presidents--That most Presidents live long and all that nonsense---The man for me is way too old sorry not on my ticket.

I have a feeling more information will be coming out about this woman and her family in the coming weeks. I know a Drama Queen when I see one and she definately is one. Talking like she got a fly stuck in her throat. Don't like the woman and I stand by that statement. I am very good at face reading and I SAY THAT WOMAN she has alot of SKELETONS IN HER CLOSET AND I DON'T WANT TO MEET THEM.

"He thinks Palin is worth the fight, and probably doesn't mind the idea of coming across as an untraditional, unexpected Republican by not scuttling her for political convenience."  That's a really astute observation. 

As for some of the other issues discussed here--they make for an interesting discussion, but it seems a little presumptious, all the same.  Every mother knows how incredibly difficult the job is, and every family has to make decisions based on a million different factors.  There is simply no way we can all know what they are considering, and what discussions might have gone on at their kitchen table in recent weeks.  I'm willing to extend another mom, in the trenches of extraordinary circumstances, a little grace here.

Shannon @ Rocks In My Dryer
www.rocksinmydryer.net ( http://www.rocksinmydryer.net/ )
BlogHer Contributing Editor, Mommy and Family

Now THAT is great info  - thank you so much - I mean, I didn't know that about Cindy McCain - very interesting, helpful.  Thought provoking - I'm sorry I didn't know that.

Is it really unfair to want to hear Gov. Palin on similar questions - and her husband too? I think this is a natural interest - even if, I will confess, I'm not sure it's mandatory to know or be revealed.  But it's the kind of thing I find to help me connect with them - if I'm going to.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Thanks for the honesty - I'm trying to be honest too - about what drives me to ask ask ask - because I'm not really sure HOW I should feel - I'm all over the place with this one! as a woman, journalist, career/ambitious, and yes - parent and mother.  AND DAUGHTER! you know - it would be interesting to know more about how her mom and she were when she was a girl - but also, community values - you know - I was just in ISrael and how they are with their kids is SO different!

Anyway - this mama needs rest but yes - thank you so so much. 

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

I have a daughter with extreme health issues.  I've also had to make the choice of what I wanted from my career and what I felt was best for my family. I gave it up to be there for her, for my other children as we dealt with life-changing circumstances. For me, I have a hard time thinking there was ever another option. Her son's needs now are simple. In the future they're not going to be, the degree of his needs are unknown.  

I hope that she's self-aware enough if the day comes, because 4 years is a long time, that she would recognize the moment the family's needs are more than her career can handle.  

I think this is a great conversation, so many different views, mothers coming from different angles and it's always eye-opening to have my perceptions changed. THIS is what I love about BlogHer.

Anissa Mayhew

www.hope4peyton.org  ( http://www.hope4peyton.org )

www.mayhewreview.com ( http://www.mayhewreview.com )

Okay, the way the question is being reframed, I can understand the curiosity.  And it does sound like the other candidates are addressing some of these issues.

Here's what I've been able to dig up so far.  Please correct me if this info is outdated:

--------------------

McCain - (From Cindy's interview with Newsweek): Over the 28 years of her often long-distance marriage to Capt. John
McCain, USN (Ret.), she says she thought of herself as a Navy wife
whose husband was off on tour—albeit on Capitol Hill instead of
somewhere in the North Atlantic. "It was almost like a deployment,"
Cindy told NEWSWEEK. "What I told the kids from the time they were
little is that their dad was deployed and serving our country in
Washington."

Cindy has sometimes likened herself to a
single mother; now 54, she has often been far away from her husband
during difficult moments, including two of three miscarriages she
suffered in the 1980s. Years later, her husband did not notice when she
became addicted to painkillers, a habit, she says, brought on in part
by the stress of politics. In 2004, he was on the other side of the
country when she suffered a stroke that left her partly debilitated. On
her own, she learned to walk again. Cindy says she doesn't resent the
time she has spent without her husband. It was her choice to stay in Arizona ( http://www.newsweek.com/related.aspx?subject=Arizo... ) while he rose in Washington, and she says she knew when she married him that he was always going to "put country first."

-------------------------

Biden - (From Wikipedia) Biden married Neilia Hunter. They had three children, Joseph, Robert Hunter, and Naomi Christina ("Amy"). His wife and infant daughter died in a car accident shortly after he was first elected
to the Senate in 1972. His two sons, Beau and Hunter, were seriously
injured in the accident, but both eventually made full recoveries.
Biden was sworn into office from their bedside. Persuaded not to resign
in order to care for them, Biden began the practice of commuting an
hour and a half each day on the train from his home in the  Wilimington suburbs to DC, which he continues to do.
In 1977, Biden married Jill Tracey Jacobs. They have one daughter, Ashley.  Jill Biden interrupted her high school teaching career while raising
their daughter and his two young sons who survived the accident. She also worked as a teacher in the adolescent program at the Rockford Center psychiatric hospital in the 1980s.
In 1987, Biden received a MA in English from Villanova University. During her husband's 1998 presidential bid, she said she would continue her job of teaching emotionally disturbed children even if she became First Lady.

 -----------------------

Obama -  (Interview with Michelle Obama, Chicago Tribune) We made a good decision to stay in Chicago, to remain based in Chicago,
so that has kept our family stable. There has been very little
transition for me and the girls. Now he's commuting a lot, but he's the
grown-up. He's the senator. He can handle it. That's really helped in
keeping us grounded. 

Q. How has the balance of time worked?

A. It's taken a good year to figure out what I, personally, can
handle and I think Barack is figuring out the same thing. Up until
September, we did great in terms of the schedule being what we
expected. He usually leaves Monday evening and comes back Thursday
evening. We were pretty good about keeping Sundays sacred. Our struggle
is more visible, but it isn't significantly different from the demands
that are placed on working-class professional families.

Q. How has your life changed?

A. I would be speaking every night of the week as the senator's wife
if I tried to meet a fraction of the requests, but I don't because I
just can't. I'm the parent, so when it comes to potlucks and play dates
and pickups and keeping the kids on cue, that's generally me. The
requests haven't died down. It's national. Sometimes I'm amazed. It's
like, are you sure you want me?

Q. Do you consider yourself--at least sometimes--a single parent?

A. Oh, heck yeah. You know, at times it can be wearing, because
you're on 24/7. Part of what we've had to figure out is what kind of
support do I need to make my life less hectic? I'd like the support to
come from Dad, but when it can't, I just really need the support. It
doesn't really matter whether it's him or not as long as our kids are
happy and they feel like they are connected to him. So I have to get
over the fact that it's not him. It's Mom, friends, baby-sitters. This
is where it's easier for us because we are professional people; we earn
enough money to have resources to help support us.

What exactly is the role of a mother? And as a mother, how does Sarah Palin's behavior predict her potential as a candidate or as a VP?

The psyche of every teenager I know is extremely delicate. I had to work through some teenage pain with my son and none of it was easy and all of it happened between me and him, his high school counselor and, for a short time, a psychologist who was truly skilled in dealing with teenagers and their parents. I would never have put him in a position where he was the subject of a national media frenzy - and he certainly wasn't pregnant.

I am also here to ask about the other people in her family - a recent birth of a developmentally disabled child and a teenager pregnant and keeping the baby puts enormous pressure on a family. I would think that Sarah Palin would be looking at her entire family and trying to figure out what she needs to do to step up and take care of these people. She has an infant who will require extraordinary love and attention. She has a teenager who has stepped out of bounds who will also require love and attention. She has three other children who are trying to figure out what's going on - I can't even understand what kind of a mother picks NOW to say, Okay, yeah, let's join the Republican ticket and run for VP.

I think she's a creep, and I mean that in the deepest, most malevolent sense of the word. She's a member of the It's All About Me Club - the creepiest club of all. Watch this family melt, right before your eyes.

And, by the way, shame on John McCain too who, knowing all this, said, I want you! We'll be following this mess for years. She should be ashamed - and we don't even know if this is the end of it. Who knows what the 12 "specialists" dispatched to Alaska will uncover?

Great quote - agreed - sums it up.

Thanks Annissa for taking this sincerely. Hope it's just the beginning for all of us, tragic weird way that it's getting started or reignited.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Perhaps crumble isn't the right phrase I'm looking for....maybe it's the feeling that people are looking for holes in her motherhood coat of honor.  

 As you said, this is bringing to the forefront, in a big splashy way, the neverending struggle between working mothers and the family.  Did we expect more from Bush because he had young teenage daughters who chose to rock the wild life?  Did we see him as a fail in parenting for their mistakes?  

In my opinion and my opinion alone, Palin has made some very questionabe choices in her quest for political success.  Making decisions at the risk of herself and her child, are her priorities straight in her homelife...can we trust that her priorities are going to be straight on a national level?  

There is a great quote on someone's blog...unfortunately I can't pinpoint who at the moment...that is from a Felicity Huffman interview.  When asked about balancing the life of a working mom, she answered,  "I rush from one thing to another and have a lot of guilt...I'm still striving to find that balance."

For me, that pretty much nails it on the head.  

Anissa Mayhew

www.hope4peyton.org  ( http://www.hope4peyton.org )

www.mayhewreview.com ( http://www.mayhewreview.com )

You know, there are a few BlogHers who are listservs I'm on and they know, I have been tortured by this today. I'm a mom who also has turned down options because I felt that I could not give what I needed to all the commitments I could have had going at one time.

So maybe this is just an amazing curiosity to me that I want to understand: how DOES a person raise five children, including an infant with special needs, AND run a state - whatever size?

Now - maybe that's not so hard - it appears that all the grandparents are alive and young and healthy - so I suppose they help and the older kids help the younger? Or something.  The dad has been around quite a bit - but it's been finessed a bit how much.

Why is it so off limits, if they are putting her front and center as a manager extraordinaire, to want to know - HOW DOES SHE DO IT?

I really really feel that while I want to stay on the political abilities related to being a VP, yes - I want to know - how does she do it - how does she expect to do it in DC and what are the costs she's willing to pay, if she thinks she's paying any costs, that indicate to her that it's still worth it?

Parents, but women in particular, make these decisions ALL THE TIME.  Let's take stock of HOW they do that - and why can't we ALL fulfill ambitions the way Sarah Palin gets to - what are OUR obstacles and how can we get support to get rid of them? How has she?

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Palin says she accepted the VP offer knowing her daughter was pregnant but that the situation was a "private, family matter."

1) If the matter is so very private, why would a mother accept such an offer knowing her daughter would be subjected to the very publicity she ostensibly wants to avoid?

2) If the matter is so very private, why was the media hand-fed the information from the Republican party?

3) Does Bristol (or the baby's father) have a choice in their future or is the decision being made by Palin? 

4) With Palin being so very underqualified for the second highest position in the country, will this just bolster her stance on pro-life?

This isn't presented as a pro-life or pro-choice arguement, but rather questioning the values of a mother who opts for a high profile, political position at the expense of her daughter, her husband and other children, the baby, the baby's father and his family. Sounds to me like pandering and pure, unadulterated narcissism on Palin's part. (And I'm a mom who turned down more than one position because I felt it would be detrimental to my family.)

Thank you very much - I think this really, truly goes to so much that we talk about on BlogHer - the work-life balance - with or without family.  These are issues we know women confront in themselves, I'm not suprised if men do too but in a different way.  I too will not be voting for McCain/Palin - and I'm really incredibly mixed up on how I feel about her situation - except that it's not political fodder per se.

But again - why not use this to open up that work-iife thing and extrapolate to how ALL women can get to pursue their ambitions when they face these challenges? 

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Fair enough.

But then we should open it up to a discussion of the effects of the campaign and potential office on the other three--McCain, Obama and Biden.

There's a difference between being judgmental and having a debate about what is reasonable to expect - perfection? everything all at once? none of either?

I want to hear other parents talk about what they've found their limits to be - what are their experiences of what is too much, what is missing, what can't they get to, AND for those who DO get to it all, how did they do that?

I refuse to accept this blanket belief that we can't discuss that - how else do we learn to expect more from ourselves - or not be so hard on ourselves - if we don't talk about this?

In regard to Palin, sure - we don't have to do that.  But to use this as an example to talk about what so many of us face as choices all the time, absolutely.  This is not pursuit of this issue - if she is a watershed, then why doesn't that include taking this opportunity to talk about something we know is something we should be talking about?

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

I don't think we can second guess the family thing, if we truly support women in the workplace and public office.

If she makes decisions about her family life in order to pursue her political career, we can't be a "mother by proxy" and pretend to know what is best for her or them.

We aren't questioning the effect that the campaign or holding office will have on Biden's, Obama's or McCain's families.

As I've said before, I'm not voting McCain/Biden, but I think that the pursuit of this issue is weak.  It's similiar to the Right claiming that the Edwards were shilling their kids by taking them on the campaign trail so that Elizabeth could keep them close.  That was also a non-issue.  

Anissa - I agree re: the issues, but if I could for just a minute re: the other -

I want to clear up something that I think is sometimes misunderstood - I don't think anyone necessarily thinks she will crumble - that isn't the issue for me at least.  The question has to do with what do her kids and family need from her, what are her priorities and how much can one person reasonably be expected to do, and how well.  I want to emphasize - I have no answers, definitions or thresholds for any of those things, but I do think that that's what's at issue in her decision-making.  Sure, she knows herself and her support network best, certainly better than we do - but do the results of how she's chosen to manage her compliment of responsibilities comport with what the country needs in a VP?

Again - this isn't about crumbling - this is about knowing one's limits and the demands.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

Ok. So Carville and a female rep from the Republican camp are being interviewed.  Carville is trying to discuss real issues.  He has clearly said that Bristol's pregnancy is not an issue for the Obama campaign.

The republican rep will talk about nothing but the pregnancy. 

Troopergate.  Road to Nowhere that she said she didn't support but turns out she did.  Just got a passport last year.  Met McCain once.  Doesn't know what a VP is. 

These are these issues that Carville is trying discuss.  The republican reps will talk nothing but pregnancy and the words I am offended on behalf of American women have been said to Carville already. 

Oy. This is going to be a trainwreck.  The republicans are being compared to and SNL sketch. 

Perhaps it's a switch in the family dynamic that people are uncomfortable with.  In a society where more fathers are able to stay home as the primary caregiver while the mother provides the financial security, we are still holding onto the idea that she will crumble under the pressures as a working mom of a special needs child and an unwed pregnant teen.  

If she is blessed with a supportive husband, a strong support network, strict personal boundaries for her family, there is nothing stopping her from being the next VP.  

I won't be voting for her, but I don't think THOSE should be the issues on the table right now.  Let's stay focused on her strengths and weaknesses as the next president, should something unexpected happen to McCain.  

Anissa Mayhew

www.hope4peyton.org 

www.mayhewreview.com ( http://www.mayhewreview.com )

Although I don't plan on voting for him, I was completely impressed with Obama's class today in handling the Palin pregnancy story. 

His mother was only 18 when he was born.  My parents were unmarried and 19/20 when I was born.  I'm glad my parents made the choice they did, and I imagine all those who are voting for Obama are glad his mother made her choice as well. 

Does it mean I judge those who make a different choice?  Absolutely not.  People have to make their own decisions based on their own circumstances.  But I'm happy my parents, who hadn't completed college, were only dating, and had zero money, chose to have me anyway.  It wasn't easy, but I'm glad to be here.

Katherine Stone

To discuss left/right, Bristol's plight, etc., ignores the real crux of the matter.  It is one thing to a teen mother in the household of the Gov. of Alaska.  It is an entirely other matter to be the teen mother in the household of a single waitress struggling to make ends meet.  Single parenthood is a breeze for the privileged, when compared to "real people".Palin, or the people hailing this as a wonderful "walk the walk" example of Palin's thoughts should not use Bristol as an "example" of what single teen motherhood really is about.

http://nakedanarchists.wordpress.com ( http://nakedanarchists.wordpress.com/ )

First things first. No matter who McCain picked, there's a snowballs chance in hell (if you believe in hell) of my voting McCain.

Now:

While I strongly believe that whatever is going on with the Palin family pregnacies is none of by business, I do think this gives us an opportunity to ask important questions about the VP candidates policies on:

Abstinence only education.
Access to contraceptives for minors.
Abortion rights (we know Palin in anti-choice)
Health care for women.

There's no way we can know the details of Bristol's preganancy - we don't know if this is a wanted child, an "accident", a failure of education, anything at all. And I don't think it's any of our business. But I do think it's our business to know the candidates stance on the related issues. 

Also, as a die hard liberal, I don't see any of Palin's family issues - her Down's syndrome baby, her teenager's pregnancy as a deterrant to her serving in office. It's sexist and demeaning, I agree completely with the right on this. Her politics, however, are another story, and that is what I, personally, will be focusing on. 

Nerd's Eye View ( http://www.nerdseyeview.com )

Here in Ohio there's been a huge battle and thank goodness our governor has refused to allow an additional dime to be spent on this. People who know and don't spin know that abstinence is absolutely taught in the sex ed classes - but not as the only method of not getting pregnant and not as something that only happens, in real life, once you get married.

http://www.abstinenceassociation.org/

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

 Many religious Christians will also view her as deceptive, and many will see it as throwing her child under the bus, but that is neither here nor there. The less on this the better for the Democrats. Her inability to be able to take John McCain's place as president can be made very clear without ever bringing up her family.  The Dems need  to concentrate on John  McCain and use the good hand they have been dealt in Obama.

I also agree it is disingenuous to tout all liberal boogers or journalists  as promoting this story from a negative standpoint, despite the fact that it is not the case. Those who are spending their time reaming the liberal blogesphere  are as willing to  propagandize anything to their advantage as those they are complaining about essentially doing the same thing they are faulting others for doing.

I've read through a number of conservative blogs and journals today and find they are concentrating like  this post is on the few in the liberal blogesphere who are demeaning her in this fashion and ignoring the other stuff.

This may work, but I am hopeful most people on either side are reading other than  journals and blog sites where preaching to the choir is the routine.

cooper

My Twitter Sister  Jstandard ( http://twitter.com/thejstandard ) posted this sentiment:

Sad reality: urban/minority teen moms receive the back end of moral criticism all of the time. no one ever publicly takes up for them.

Love,

Babz

Marriage by any means necessary!

Love,

Babz

Can you provide a link for this?  I wasn't aware of it, and the American teenagers deserve better odds against unplanned pregnancy than that. 

Yay, thanks for the clarification! I agree with this comment of yours. The McCain politicizing is a turnoff for me.  Just after saying that now is a time to focus on the Gustav victims; not politics, they release info on what will end up detracting focus from Gustav.  Why couldn't this announcement wait a couple days? I don't think it is likely the story would have leaked.

Mary Katharine, you wrote, "she has a family in which normal challenges have to be overcome..."

Here's a great fact sheet ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html ) on teen sex:

•Most young people have sex for the first time at about age 17, but do
not marry until their middle or late 20s. This means that young adults
are at risk of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections
(STIs) for nearly a decade.[3 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n3 )]

And about teen pregnancy:

•Each year, almost 750,000 women aged 15-19 become pregnant.
Overall, 75 pregnancies occur every year per 1,000 women aged 15-19;
this rate has declined 36% since its peak in 1990.[25 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n25 )]

•The majority of the decline in teen pregnancy rates is due to more
consistent contraceptive use; the rest is due to higher proportions of
teens choosing to delay sexual activity.[26 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n26 )]

And:

•Eighty-two percent of teen pregnancies are unplanned; they account
for about one in five of all unintended pregnancies annually.[29 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n29 )]

•Two-thirds of all teen pregnancies occur among 18-19-year-olds.[30 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n30 )]

Finally:

•Eleven percent of all U.S. births are to teens.[32 ( http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ATSRH.html#n32 )]

Feel free to link other stats - that's just what I found and there's other interesting stuff in there on abortion and pregnancy outcomes.

Having a 17 year old who is pregnant, in a family that values no contraceptive education other than abstinence and absolute prohibition of abortion is not normal in the usual definition of that word.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks ( http://www.writeslikeshetalks.com )

I'm sorry if I did not come off right: I absolutely respect her decision to have her baby. I am protesting the layers of hypocrisy that are exposed here. Perhaps this is a good place for people to just step back and realize that every woman who faces an unexpected pregnancy considers her options thoroughly and this is not a area where anyone does anything without thinking.  And if we really were a kinder more compassionate nation, we would respect that.

www.rebelliousthoughtsofawoman.com ( http://www.rebelliousthoughtsofawoman.com )