Congressional Black Caucus Democratic Debate OPEN THREAD DISCUSSION

Stefania, you know I agree with everything you said!

I don't appreciate the petty "nyah-nyah" personal attacks. As Obama said last night, no politician's hands are clean. We all know this, don't we? I think that's why I found it gross that Obama and Clinton were engaged in--what seemed to me to be--childish one-upmanship. You were on the board of WalMart! Oh yeah? You worked for a slumlord! Oh yeah? Nanny-boo-boo. We all know every candidate could dig up dirt on each other for dayzzzzz...so why not set that aside and discuss, oh, I don't know issues? As Edwards pointed out, how does that kind of bickering help to make sure people have insurance, to end poverty etc.

I'll put this out there: I think Democrats are wrapped up in the idea of picking a "historic" candidate and that's why Edwards gets shoved to the side. This isn't a game show--we don't have to pick between the car and the tropical vacation. Edwards consistently wins debates, stays on message, brings it back to issues. And yet, in every debate, he has to answer to some form of "how does it feel to be the white guy in this race." Granted, they don't have female or non-white candidates in the running, but Republicans aren't worried about being "historic." They are voting their conscience. I think that if Dems allowed themselves to view each of the Democratic candidates race/gender aside, they might be supporting a different candidate (and that includes not only Edwards, but Biden or Richardson or Gravel).

Stefania Pomponi Butler

I blog:
CityMama ( http://citymama.typepad.com )
Kimchi Mamas ( http://kimchimamas.typepad.com )
MOMocrats ( http://momocrats.typepad.com )

I LIKED them-the Obama WalMart quip? CLASSIC. Then when Hillary went back at him with the slum lord stuff?

I feel like they are finally getting it all out there. I didn't think it was a low blow-I mean she WAS an attorney on WalMart's board and he DID have ties to that guy-I feel like they are finally communicating and really getting into it.

Could they have been nicer? I don't know. I'm tired of just standing up there and everyone trading press release lines.

It did annoy me that Edwards really seems to have been pushed aside. Even the pundits after the debate were LAUGHING when they had to be reminded Edwards was there too.

Politics & News Contributing Editor
Queen of Spain ( http://queenofspainblog.com/ )

Strong language!

I would love to know what behavior you found so "disgusting
because I had to miss the debate and tuned in here to find out what ya'll think. What did Sens. Clinton and Obama do to elicit your response? Know you're an Edwards fan, so see my outtake from his 2004 debate with Cheney above.

Lisa Stone
BlogHer Co-founder ( http://www.blogher.com/member/lisa-stone )
Surfette ( http://surfette.typepad.com )

Once, just once, I'd like to see someone moderate a debate with a focus on the issues. The debates are like a spin room to the masses and I hate spin alley ( http://journalism.nyu.edu/pubzone/weblogs/pressthi... ). The only person I've ever seen effectively manage a debate is Gwen Ifill (PBS), who did a crack job of moderating the vice-presidential debate in the 2004 election. Here's an outtake I found on the archived blog, Tales of a Shrink ( http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:RTW3N5FyFrUJ:... ) -- which is obviously by a Democrat:

We all made a new friend last night, didn't we?

Gwen Ifill.

I watched the Vice-Presidential debate last night, and it angered up my blood so I didn't get much sleep last night. I'm sure that other people will talk about the issues raised, so I'm not going to do that. Besides, no one cares about the issues. The wonderful thing about a two-party system is that people already know where the candidates stand on the issues. This was about image, likeability, leadership, and effectiveness. Remember that 80% of your message is how you say it, and only 10% is what you say. I'm calling this one a draw, but if I had to, I'd give it to Edwards. Here are my thoughts:

1) Gwen Ifill (the moderator) rocks. Take this exchange:

Cheney (chuckling malevolently): "It'll take more than 30 seconds to rebut that."
Gwen Ifill (no-nonense tone): "Well, that's all you get."
Audience: Snap!

2) Dick Cheney is evil. Just look at the man. And a little hint to the Republicans: Don't dress Cheney in a black suit. It doesn't help his image. I'm thinking I should come up with a clever way of referring to our Veep. Any suggestions? I'm leaning towards something like Mr. Evil, MBA.

3) John Edwards is likeable, and has that all-important I-Sound-Like-Andy-Griffith thing, which tends to comfort American voters.

4) Edwards did a good job of taking the debate to Cheney, confronting him on misleading the American people, and on giving no-bid contracts to his former company. However, Edwards missed a lot of opportunities to strike back at Cheney, and he didn't do such a great job of defending his own positions.

5) John Edwards gave one of the best closing statements I've ever heard, period. I wanted to jump up and shout, "Edwards in '04!" All those years as a trial lawyer paid off.

THIS is why we need the candidates to agree to come on-camera with one of our contributing editors and answer the questions in our Voter Manifesto ( http://www.blogher.com/women-bloggers-presidential... ).

Lisa Stone
BlogHer Co-founder ( http://www.blogher.com/member/lisa-stone )
Surfette ( http://surfette.typepad.com )

I will support him until the bitter end and the way he conducted himself in tonight's debate is why. He consistently brings it back to ISSUES and stays on message. "It's not about us personally, it's about our country."

Seriously, the way Hillary and Barack conducted themselves tonight was disgusting. And they want to be president? Yeah, right.

Again, Edwards was declared the winner of the debate (for the kajillionth time), and again I am shocked that he's not blowing the barn doors off this entire race. I feel sick to my stomach because I know that if Hillary or Barack become president (which they won't) NOTHING will change. Tonight sealed that deal for me.

Stefania Pomponi Butler

I blog:
CityMama ( http://citymama.typepad.com )
Kimchi Mamas ( http://kimchimamas.typepad.com )
MOMocrats ( http://momocrats.typepad.com )

Although they've made some efforts to ask issue specific questions, there is way too much questioning about the horse race aspect. I'm tired of debate moderators thinking that voters care about the nonsense about campaigning and not about issues.

PopConsumer ( http://consumerpop.typepad.com/popconsumer )
Beyond Help ( http://mariax.vox.com/ )

The New York Times Katharine Q. Seelye ( http://http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/... ) is live blogging from South Carolina.

Politics & News Contributing Editor
Queen of Spain ( http://queenofspainblog.com/ )

...and I wasn't sure what had happened-CNN has the scoop.

Apparently Clinton said ( http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/01/21/sc... ) Obama does not take responsibility for his votes-and this crowd is very pro-Obama.

Politics & News Contributing Editor
Queen of Spain ( http://queenofspainblog.com/ )