BlogHer - Another take: Mel Gibson's Apocalypto - Comments

Whaat?

lainad — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:59:06 -0600

1. First,Alexandra, you need to find the definition of what racism and what consitutes as being a racist.

2. There is a huge difference between an American actor playing an English character and the decision by Gibson to cast non-Mayan actors in a film about the Maya People. Perhaps you should read the above comments (especially Atena - but wait - is she a racist too?) from other Bloghers if you are still confused. As I am not in the movie business, I can only assume that Americans playing English characters and vice-versa is more about who is better suited to the role.

In the case of television shows like House,The Wire, and Without a Trace, there are English actors (black and white) playing American characters. Those casting choices have nothing to do with racism - again, you need to check that definition.

3. As for the rest of your comment, you are responding to things that I did not even say in my original post (like my deep connection to the Maya people?)I would suggest you read the article from The Nation, which is what inspired me to write the post. Overall your response confuses me because your assumptions really do not make any sense. I can take criticism, but please be a bit more accurate and have some concrete evidence before you make personal jabs.

Lainad's issues

AlexandraWatson — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 07:02:56 -0600

The issues Lainad raised are fully based around being racist, I personally feel that for you to find this film racist you havenâ€™t seen it and have are very closed minded. I donâ€™t hear you having you little issues about Americans playing English in movies or Americans playing Australians, only that you feel some hidden connection with Mayans or that youâ€™d rather cry out in shame for them then any other country and that in its self is racist on your part. You feel that Mayans are more important then any other group of people, how very hypocritical of you, fighting a fight when it suits you and not for others.

As far as your dislike for Mels movie, you not buying a ticket wonâ€™t bug him in the slightest Iâ€™m sure he doesnâ€™t even know you exist nor would her truly care. If you can put him down for making a mistake like any human does, unless youâ€™re calling yourself more then human and that is racist again. How can any of the people on here talk about him in such a harsh way when you could make the mistake the same way he did and no one would ever know except the party your with because you donâ€™t have cameras everywhere you go, how can you put him down when everyone from time to time as other people have admitted to on here, everyone says something racist from time to time. So just because he happen to of said it and he is in the movies and mags all the time you feel you have the right to put him down. Although you wouldnâ€™t give it a second thought if it was just an everyday person.

And you issues with whom he used in his movie to get his point across why should that matter. As I pointed out we use Americans for next to everything in a movie, showing any or every country and you cry out over this. How can you put down a man and a movie when you yourself have nothing to compare. Who cares what size a head is or the colour of the skin yet again in pointing all this out you are being racist, all that should matter is the story and this history he is trying to show everyone, to being the Mayans back to life and maybe even, for those that suffer so greatly as you say, giving them more meaning for those around them that do not understand them.

Another take on Apocalypto...

Atena — Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:31:29 -0600

This post from a few days ago by Liza Grandia (found within Negrito Bueno's blog) is quite relevant to this conversation. I haven't seen Apocalypto, but I found the analysis here quite interesting, as I know little-to-nothing of Maya culture. The issues brought up here would have totally passed under my radar if I hadn't read this:

As a cultural anthropologist who has worked for thirteen years among different Maya peoples of Mesoamerica and who speaks the Q'eqchi' Maya language fluently, I found Apocalypto to be deeply racist. The Maya in the film bore no resemblance to the hardworking farmers, teachers, lawyers, doctors, businessmen and women of Maya descent that I know personally and consider among my closest friends.

I fear the repercussions Apocalypto will have on contemporary Maya people who continue to struggle for survival and political governments under discriminatory governments that consider them stupid, backward, and uncivilized for wanting to maintain their customs and language. Gibson's slanderous film reinforces the same stereotypes that have facilitated the genocide of Maya peoples and the plunder of their lands starting with the Spanish invasion of 1492 and continuing through the Guatemalan civil war to the present.

Rather than quibble about Apocalypto's many historical and archaeological inaccuracies as other academic critics have done, I focus here on four racist messages the film sends to audiences:

Read the whole post for Grandia's thoughtful breakdown of the four racist messages she received from the film (Grandia's article comprises the second half of the post).

Atena

Assumptions, Biases & Irrational Fantasies

My Life As a Radical Whore/Madonna

I saw Apocalypto

Alexis Pierre-Louis — Fri, 22 Dec 2006 09:27:10 -0600

Gibson's anti-Semetic rant was indefensible; I did not see Passion of the Christ (but I probably will). However, I did see Apocalypto. I agree with the concerns about the lack of Mayan actors for major roles (but it is not true that there were no Mayan actors in the film), and I think Rob Schmidt's blog, Newspaper Rock, (which focuses on Native Americans and pop culture) expounded on this topic in a very relevant way with interesting comments from Native Americans.

The interesting thing about Apocalypto is that people who weren't talking about Mayan culture are doing so now, and Apocalypto renewed interest in the Mayan language as much as Passion renewed interest in the Aramaic language. Despite what one may think of Mel Gibson, Apocalypto was an excellent movie.

Thank you for the thought provoking blog post, and for keeping the spotlight on this important topic.

Alexis Pierre-Louis,
Fine Artist & Metalsmith
APL Art Jewelry

No interest in it

A Elliot — Fri, 15 Dec 2006 19:38:27 -0600

I really enjoyed reading your post. I agree with Fish that I'm not sure that the average movie goer knows about this. The more I hear/read about Mel Gibson, the more I dislike him. I will not be seeing this movie either. I also boycotted Passion of the Christ.
A. Elliot

Thank you

tish — Wed, 13 Dec 2006 12:03:33 -0600

Thank you for bringing this ethnic issue to our attention. It may not be something the average movie-goer would ever think about. Your opening paragraph was very compelling -- I had to read on and was glad that I did.

tish

Travels with Tish -- Girlfriends' Getaway Guide

E-mail tish at girlfriends-getaway@midwestairlines.com
girlfriendsgetaway.wordpress.com

I plan to boycott this film

Neasa — Wed, 13 Dec 2006 10:16:45 -0600

I plan to boycott this film just as I did his Passion. I simply don't feel like giving Mr.Gibson any of my money at present. Maybe I'll send it to the ACLU or some other worthy human rights charity instead. Hey! That might be a fun little fund-raiser campaign to start, huh?

I think most of us have racist &/or prejudicial aspects in our personalities, so I'm no better than Mel - degree of flaw being irrelevant here, imo. But I don't think gorging an already overstuffed bank account to others' detriment while claiming to be spiritually superior is quite the most sacred thing to do. So I won't be supporting Mel's efforts to that end. I will pray for both him & myself, though.

Happy holidays

I suspect that the only

Absurda — Tue, 12 Dec 2006 16:01:53 -0600

I suspect that the only things that matter when it comes to casting are: big names, beautiful people and (in some cases, but not all) talent. Whether or not the actor/actress is the same ethnicity as the character doesn't seem to be much of a consideration. The question is, how much leeway can/do we give Hollywood for that?

That said, I have no intention of ever seeing this movie so I can't really say much about it except that SFGate.com had a really good article (warning, there's a spoiler in it) about the movie's depiction of the Maya: Link Text. The end of the movie, as dicussed in the article, probably gives a better view to Gibson's motives/agenda than the casting does.

Another take: Mel Gibson's Apocalypto

lainad — Tue, 12 Dec 2006 11:28:07 -0600

Not a fan of either Mel Gibson or blood and gore, I avoided Passion of the Christ and his latest film Apocalypto. While it topped this past weekend's box office sales, the film has not incited as much controversy and boycotting that Passion of the Christ did. But it should. The problem is, does anyone care?

The film, which is set in ancient Maya, follows the main character as he tries to save his wife and child and avenge his fellow villagers after they are massacred by a group of mauraders. While it has been lauded as an accurate depiction of life in Central America before the colonization of the Spanish, there have been some questions about the casting of the film.

Maybe itâ€™s because of the director, whose anti-Semitic rants got him in hot water earlier this year or because of his own religious beliefs, but while lauded as an excellent filmmaker, trouble seems to follow Gibson â€“ albeit mostly self-imposed. The controversy begins with Gibsonâ€™s decision to cast non-Maya people with no previous acting experience despite the fact that there are approximately one million Maya who reside in Mexico, where the movie was filmed. There are also at least 100,000 Maya people who speak the difficult Yucatecan Maya language. The actors in the film had to learn in the language for the movie.

In his article for The Nation, Earl Shorris, who has considerable knowledge about Latin America, looks at the lives of Maya people in Mexico today, the amount of discrimination they face in Mexico and the fight to maintain the Yucatecan Maya language where he says is not commonly spoken within Mexico, as Maya people, especially the younger generation have internalized the discrimination about their language and culture. Shorris writes that Gibson motives should be questioned and the absence of Maya people in front of the camera does a disservice to the Mayan people by perpetrating racial stereotypes:

The YucatÃ¡n is not entirely a white world, yet the Maya suffer the most severe prejudice of any large ethnic group in Mexico. In the language of prejudice in Mexico, the Maya are said to be people with big heads and no brains, too short, too dark and with a strange, laughable Spanish accent. Gibson accepted the stereotype and embellished it.

While his press junkets have been geared primarily to Latino and Native American groups and his decision to cast non-Maya actors was because they â€œlooked like you imagined they should," one wonders if Gibson was aware of the racism that exists within Mexico against Maya people and wanted to use actors whose looks where more socially palatable for a wider audience.

This is not the first time where there has been some talk about the ethnic authenticity of characters in movies (Memoirs of a Geisha, World Trade Center,A Mighty Heart - the upcoming Biopic on Marianne Pearl - and Halle Berry's upcoming flick),But coming from Gibson, one has to wonder what his motives are. Hell, perhaps he is just dealing with the reality of our racist society, giving the public what they want, but on the other hand, he is benefiting from the history of a people who continue to struggle for equality.