BlogHer - Hillary Clinton is Not My Politician - Comments

Richardson loses my vote

nelle2nelle — Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:13:04 -0600

Richardson loses my vote based on his same sex marriage stance. Hillary has stated she is against it as well, so stay tuned... but all things being equal, a person who comes out for same sex marriage will be a mighty tempting vote.

nelle

Thank you, Suzanne

Maria Niles — Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:20:29 -0600

Thanks for your answer and for the link to the very good Salon article.

She's definitely a bit of a pretzel but I wonder what politician can avoid that other than Bush who sticks with a position no matter what. I wrote a paper in grad school where I argued that Bill Clinton lost a bit in the public eyes when he backed down on gays in the military because we Americans admire politicians who stand firm for their beliefs (but since we don't always reward that behavior with votes, we get what we ask for). However, even while going back on some of his campaign promises Bill was still a president I think did a great job. Perhaps at least with with Hillary we know where she's willing to bend before the election and we can decide if the end justifies the means. *Sigh*

Semi-answer

Suzanne Reisman — Wed, 14 Feb 2007 11:08:16 -0600

A more recent article at salon.com (http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/10/16/hillary/index2.html) says the following:
"After the 2004 election, the woman who wouldn't change her name and who was the keynote speaker at NARAL's 30th anniversary celebration joined the herd of Democrats distancing themselves from the pro-choice plank in the Democratic platform."

It's not exactly a smoking gun quote, I admit. I accordingly will change my much stronger language in the original post and note the correction. I highly recommend the full Salon article, though, because it really details all the changes that Clinton adapted to make herself into a supposedly more palatable moderate.

Suzanne, BlogHer Contributing Editor - Feminsim & Gender
Campaign for Unshaved Snatch (CUSS)& Other Rants

Media darlings

Mixter64 — Wed, 14 Feb 2007 08:27:13 -0600

Right now Clinton and Obama are the media's darlings. However, we need to stay educated and not let the media decide who our candidate should be.

Me? I'm supporting Gov. Bill Richardson. Bill Richardson is the most skilled and proven leader of all the candidates, and even though he's considered to be an "underdog," he's probably what's best for our country right now.

Mixter

I recall her suggesting a

nelle2nelle — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 18:18:16 -0600

I recall her suggesting a path where we embrace the common ground shared by more moderate (there is that word again) pl and pcers.

For instance, we could throw abstinence only in the closest dumpster and start fully educating our children on what they face in life, instead of ostrich head in the sand instruction. Pretend your body does not do these things, and that you do not have these feelings. Universal health care is a second good option where we could potentially find agreement, though the structure of such a system will lead to more than a few political barroom brawls. And finally bring forth readily available and cheap contraception.

Anyway, I'm ambivalent about Hillary. People do indeed get riled by her, but if you ask for specifics, good luck. You would think they were talking about Mao, and her record is a bit east of Mao. Then there is Bill, where many blame her for not throwing his arse to the street. Let me get this um... correct. Blame Hillary?

That said, her move to the middle did bother me some, but then I *am* a pinko liberal, hardly average America politically (or any otherically.)

Yet I'm torn. Seriously torn.

From a distance, I am intrigued by Obama. He carries an intangible, or intangibles, a la JFK, though JFK had far more experience behind him when he ran. He has that uniting element our current incumbent screamed to the world and then discarded. He might well be in the right place at the right time.

Yet... 216 years, by the time of the election. 216 years with no woman as president or veep. Women representing 17% or so of Congress... the highest rate ever, which means even now, 83% of this important body are men. And in all that time, two (2) Supreme Court justices.

I've said in the past I'd vote for a woman if she was within a certain margin of acceptability. In other words all things being somewhat equal, my vote would go in that direction.

There are others, surely. I voted for Carole Mosely Braun in the NH primary in 2004, and might take a good long look at Christine Whitman if she ran. Our ex governor, Jeanne Shaheen, would get my vote if she ever drummed up the audacity to run.

At this point... I just don't know. Well, I do know this. If Hillary wins in 2008, I will not be crying.

nelle

But isnt what makes Hillary her electable her (lack of) stances

Morra Aarons Mele — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 18:03:02 -0600

Suzanne, you write, "...Clinton made a speech in which she suggested that Democrats drop the right to a legal abortion from their plank. According to the New York Times, Clinton declared, â€œThere is an opportunity for people of good faith to find common ground in this debate - we should be able to agree that we want every child born in this country to be wanted, cherished and loved.â€
Clinton's stance as an abortion gray, a sometimes hawk, and general toughie is the one thing that would make a woman in this country electable....am I too cynical?

Question, Suzanne

Maria Niles — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 13:49:42 -0600

I think you've done an excellent job of giving a voice to the misgivings many of us have about Hillary. I think she's been a very effective Senator for New York (I wish she's stay in the Senate and become the Senate leader) and if she's the nominee she'll get my vote - but I'm working for Barak.

However, I have one question - I have heard Hillary articulate her compromise-seeking "safe, legal and rare" position which is actually one of her positions that I admire the most - I think it might appeal to a majority of Americans and could actually move us to a place where we can ensure that abortion is legally available (and importantly, accessible) to any women who needs one while working to reduce the need through sex education and workable options for child support - though it appears to have been poorly received by supporters on both sides of the issue so apparently I'm naive.

I would, however, view Hillary entirely differently on this issue if she is suggesting dropping Democratic support for legal abortion. What I'm wondering is if you can point me to where she called for this? I don't see it in the Times article you linked to but if I'm reading you correctly it sounds like the call you heard came a year earlier. As I mentioned, I'm supporting Barak Obama so it wont change my position on Hillary Clinton but I am very curious now that you've made me aware.

Thanks!

amen

Mir Kamin — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 08:02:42 -0600

Suzanne... I think I love you. ;)

--
Mir from WCS
(BlogHer Mommy & Family contributing editor)

Personal: Woulda Coulda Shoulda

Having it all with less: Want Not

Found this online opinion at

kweenkong — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:32:44 -0600

Found this online opinion at today's Washington Post, which echoes much of our sentiment about Sen. Clinton: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/12/AR200702...

I Couldn't Agree More!

kweenkong — Tue, 13 Feb 2007 03:55:56 -0600

Unfortunately, you've read my mind and articulated my thoughts about Hillary to a "t." She's just about become irrelevant to me of late, when I was among her biggest fans at one point.

It started to unravel for me when she voted to blindly fund Bush's war. And then, she wanted to stand in Congress and fuss like an enabling mother about giving him the money.

I hadn't heard that interesting tidbit you mentioned, about her suggesting the Dems switch their stance on abortion. Wow... Maybe she should align with another party? At the very least, seems like she needs to fire her current campaign advisors before she really hits the tipping point.

All of this to say that on Saturday, upon listening to Barack Obama officially launch his campaign, I officially decided that he'd get my vote (barring a dissapointing misstep between now and then).

Senator Clinton is not going to pick-up any new votes by fence-sitting and piping down this way; she'll only lose one-time supporters such as you and me.

Hillary Clinton is Not My Politician

Suzanne Reisman — Mon, 12 Feb 2007 22:52:54 -0600

Hillary Clinton is dead to me.

This occurred long before she officially declared that she was running for president but began selling out large parts of her agenda to make herself more palatable to â€œmoderates,â€ who she seems to believe stand for absolutely nothing, so she should not either.

Forget the fact that approximately half of the nation already hates her and decided that she is a pinko communist scumbag. She could declare herself to be William Kristolâ€™s #1 fan, become BFFs with Ann Coulter, and kiss Bill Oâ€™Reillyâ€™s ass from today until the end of the world, but she will not change most peopleâ€™s minds about what she believes.

Other than shedding her convictions like a reptile regenerates limbs, her other big tactic appears to be to remind people that she is married to Bill Clinton.

Yes, I remember. Whoop-de-doo.

The transition to appease began early in Clinton's Senate career (or even earlier, according to an article in Salon.com), and it continually rankled me until Jan. 2005. I was visiting the HQ of the nonprofit organization I worked for at the time, and passed a few minutes while waiting for a colleague at the end of the day by reading the newspaper online. The normal quiet and calm of the mellow Northern Cali office was shattered by the charming combination of my nasal Chicago accent and vivid New York street vocabulary when I read that Clinton made a speech in which ~~she suggested that Democrats drop the right to a legal abortion from their plank~~. (Correction: she never explicitly called for this, but her remarks have led her to be grouped with other Democrats who are distancing themselves from pro-choice plank. Apologies for this mistake, and thanks to Maria Niles for pointing this out in the comments below.-SR) According to the New York Times, Clinton declared, â€œThere is an opportunity for people of good faith to find common ground in this debate - we should be able to agree that we want every child born in this country to be wanted, cherished and loved.â€

Well, what sane individual on earth would disagree with that statement? But sometimes shit happens. No matter how careful a couple is, birth control sometimes fails. Even abstinence fails when it is not used 100% correctly, 100% of the time. Life is tricky. Sometimes a couple tries and tries for a kid and then finds out that it will die an excruciating death not long after being born while also risking the motherâ€™s life. The point is that we all want abortion to be rare. We need it to be legal because shit happens.

Anyway, that is the type of sell out I personally cannot support, my â€œcome to Jesus moment,â€ so to speak. There were no more excuses I could make to myself to continue to like Hil and respect myself in the morning. To quote a friend, Hillary Clinton is a politician in all the worst senses of the word. It makes me horribly sad to write this because way back in the late â€˜90s, I thought this headband wearing working mom was a role model. I adored her. I believed she'd go places and do awesome things. Yet going through the grindstone of DC has left her a hollow woman.

Maybe my reaction is over the top, but I am not the only person who noticed her careful machinations before her official declaration. Elisa at Come Speak to Me 2 noted:

Hillary has probably been thinking about running for president for years. Evidence? She's ambitious, she takes herself seriously, and her words and actions as a senator are always carefully rendered with the utmost calculation. Risk and passion are notable by their absence.

Not everyone is a cynic like me who thinks this is a bad thing. Kaite at Grandma was a Suffragette urges readers to, â€œSign up to Hillary's website to join the HillRaisers and support Hillary in her bid to become the first female POTUSâ€¦â€ and sites the inspiring credo of the fundraising organization Emilyâ€™s List. There are legions more like Kaite, who are still able to see the good side. Which is nice. If no one has hope, where does that leave tthe world?

Still, Iâ€™m left hoping that Barak Obama, my other favorite politician from the Chicago area, can avoid the blanding-oneâ€™s-self-for-public-consumption catch. Itâ€™s a simple feminist credo, really: we like you for who you are, not who you think we want you to be.

Suzanne also blogs like the bitter hag she is at Campaign for Unshaved Snatch (CUSS) & Other Rants