BlogHer - Blogging for free: Would you do it? - Comments

I agree

jodifur — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 08:43:50 -0500

That site drives traffic to jodifur, and also, I love it. I love the writers, and I love the stories I get to cover. But your right, maybe I need to start valuing myself a little more, even though I learned at blogher dc I'm a "little blogger."

Assuming you generally recieve pay to blog in the first place.

Wyliekat — Tue, 14 Oct 2008 12:53:03 -0500

Hells, I'm happy to recieve any remuneration for blogging. I love to blog, I do it anyway, so any money I make is found money, literally.

That said, I'm also cognizant of the fact that there's something somewhat wrong about my attitude. Well, maybe not "wrong". But . . . problematic, let's say.

I've read/heard a lot about women as money-makers, and a lot also about how we (as a whole) are somewhat responsible for the fact that we (again, as a whole) make less money than our male counterparts.

Which is to say - we're willing to work for less, because we're just happy to be working.

Until we recognize our own labours as intrinsically valuable, be that work in the home, or writing a blog (or beyond), we're still going to be mired in the lower payscale area.

Still, I can't quite convince myself to demand more for my time. Truly, I've always thought that if I was getting paid for something I loved (however nominal the amount may be), then I will have achieved something.

I guess I'll have to remain part of the problem.

blogging / Network Marketing

Trudyj — Tue, 14 Oct 2008 12:36:01 -0500

Hello Heather,

I totally agree with you. However, more people are using blogging as a means to monetize their opportunity. I am guilty of this myself. Originally, blogging was used as a means of communication. When you are in network marketing these days, you try to monetize everything you get your hands on which is sad because I feel that the reason why 97 percent of markerters fail is because of this particular area where network marketing suppose to be a relatiomship building. But instead, it has become all about the money with no heart in it, thus the number of failures are all around us

http://www.trubyshomebiz.com

The Bitch Needs Personal Space

Softhearted Bitch — Mon, 13 Oct 2008 23:11:10 -0500

Softhearted Bitch

I find that my life is so crowded with people, work, to-do lists and obligations (and my house is often crowded with the same) that blogging for free provides a space that's just for me. My non-paying blog is not a personal diary blog. I discuss the news of the day and bitch about it. But I don't share my blog with my partner, close friends or family members. It's just my space to say what I want, think what I want and get feedback without judgment.

I am a paid blogger in my main career, but I believe that there is room for both.

http://softheartedbitch.blogspot.com/

The two-tiered approach

Liz Rizzo — Mon, 13 Oct 2008 10:04:37 -0500

Seems rather smart, actually. I'd be much more likely to accept an invitation to blog for free on a site that potentially/regularly bumps people up to a paying gig.

And, of course, community posts on BlogHer can be whatever you want them to be, which is so cool! Self-promotion, communication, expression, etc. I think the platform here is pretty damn cool. :)

Liz Rizzo

I blog at Everyday Goddess.

I agree

Liz Rizzo — Mon, 13 Oct 2008 09:38:07 -0500

I've been blogging on BlogHer as a contributing editor since the beginning and back in the day the commitment was significantly different - less words, no assigned days, fewer link requirements. I think it really comes down to that. There's a big difference between, Hey, post something once a month on my little blog about this topic you love, and something that's a true time and spirit commitment.

Liz Rizzo

I blog at Everyday Goddess.

Writing for free for yourself...

Liz Rizzo — Mon, 13 Oct 2008 09:31:39 -0500

On your own blog is different from writing for free for someone else who is making money off your writing. I don't really understand why anyone would do that - at least not for too long, and not unless it truly was a great opportunity; guess it's more in my nature to start my own site to write on and build it up.

That said, I agree with people who are writing for a smaller site because they love it, or the occasional guest post. Funny though, I hardly ever read guest posts on blogs. I almost always skip them because I read blogs to read the person who's blog it is. It's a little different if it's a group blog and the guest post is on a similar topic, but on a personal blog, I hardly ever read guest posts.

Liz Rizzo

I blog at Everyday Goddess.

Yes, Anali pegs the difference

Elisa Camahort — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 21:32:25 -0500

The editors on this site have "beats" and adhere to schedules. So, it's a job, and they are compensated.

Everyone else has total choice. What you blog, when you blog, if you blog. And many many folks also make the choice to blog here to promote their own blog...so posting a teaser and then a link to their own blog, and that's totally cool with us.

I contribute to or have contributed to various sites for free under the right circumstances...passion or self-promotion being the two most common. But it's the sites where they're trying to line up reliable, professional-grade content and contribution without treating the blogger like a professional in other senses of the word: that does get to me, I admit it.

[And sometimes it's *new* sites where the established bloggers they're inviting will probably do them more good than they'd do the blogger!]

I think all of our blogs are making us more powerful than we realize :)

Elisa Camahort Page
BlogHer
elisa@blogher.com

My BlogHer profile truly shows you everything I do online...Check it out!!

Art v. Commerce

msjen — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 20:46:59 -0500

When I was in college in the Art Department, we were amusingly self-separated into Artists and Art Whores (aka Fine Arts and Design). As one of the Artists who unfortunately has found herself in a 10+ year career in web design, I see this debate in terms of a different rubric.

My family told me, "Get the design degree and do your art in the evenings or on Sunday." I hated hearing that. While it may be a fiscal reality, it sucks.

I blog in the evenings and on Sundays (or comment as this case may be) on my own blog, 2 group blogs, and one professional blog. All for free or with ads that pay so little it may well be for free, because I love it, as well as I have something to say and I don't want to have an editor breath down my neck for some piddly paycheck.

Now, don't write me off as the dreamer artiste who is out chasing butterflies in my head.

Since 1996, I have written for both love and for pay - in print and online. When I have been paid, be it for rock journalism or professional cirriculum articles, the prices have ranged from $.25 to $.85 per word. But I don't really enjoy writing for pay, I find it stressful and I would much rather write when the muse hits and not have an editor wondering where those 1,500 words are. I think the Dog ate them... At least, I hope he did.

But people, $1 for 500 words? Hello! Hello! One might as well write for fun and love for free at that price.

It does not cheapen any of our writing if some of us write for pay (whores v. smart writer) or if some of us write for love / free (artist vs. cheap sellout), because in the end if your gift is being served, who cares if you were paid for it or not?

Black Phoebe :: Ms. Jen
Barflies.net
Around Ireland
The Happy Tastebud

There's A Difference

Anali — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 16:28:53 -0500

I think the difference here is the idea of blogging for free on our own blogs or other blogs or websites where we choose to submit our content. Sure that is blogging for free, but that is what we choose for ourselves.

For me the issue is when someone approaches me or wants "to hire" someone to blog for them for free or a pittance. That is an insult. It takes time to blog. We write, research, take photographs, and sometimes choose recipes and cook in order to do one post. It can take hours to do a good post. Time is money.

If a company is profitable, they should share the profits with their writers. Yes, bloggers are writers. I know companies and marketing consultants value bloggers' content and even value having a link to their company on certain blogs. Yet they don't want to pay a fair amount for that value that they would receive.

You companies out there - pay people what they are worth. We know that you value the content, otherwise you wouldn't want it.

http://www.analisfirstamendment.blogspot.com/

A lot of us blog for free... right here on BlogHer!

apietrangelo — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 15:04:45 -0500

No disrepect intended, but to ask the question "would you blog for free?" on a site where women are encouraged to blog for free seems odd. While this site pays its contributing editors, it also relies on repeat visits and participation from free bloggers... like me.

I fall into both camps. I have three blogs of my own, and two clients who pay me to blog. I am actively seeking additional opportunities to blog for compensation, but I agree that my pay rate must coincide with the value of my work. Sites like examiner.com and today.com, with their low pay rates, are not the way to go.

Excellent topic.

Ann Pietrangelo

AnnPietrangelo.com

Well said

Ms. Debris — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:22:57 -0500

That seems to my point in a nutshell and I will agree with you on all points!

Here, here!

Cheers, Holly

One Missing Component

Megan Smith — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:12:10 -0500

Last year I was offered the opportunity to write a blog for about $5 a post. However the publishers wanted six posts a week, I had to acquire photos, do research on the topic and eveything else involved with posting. I counter proposed a different amount that wasn't crazy, but which was just enough to not make me feel taken advantage of when I would be struggling over those six posts a week. Well, the publishers then withdrew the offer entirely.

As a newbie blogger, at first I was disappointed, but more than that, I was angry. I basically thought, if they liked my writing, someone else would also. Someone's who was willing to pay for it. And I was actually relieved that I didn't end up in a position that I knew I was going to regret.

I think one missing component in this discussion has been the idea of quality. Of course it's fine for people to write for free if they feel that it's their way of expressing themselves, or it's their hobby or it's for a charitable endeavor, or it's a way to get their feet wet.

But for money making operations or corporations to expect someone to write for them for free is an insult. It's about raising the level of the definition of a blogger. The corporate entities would like to continue to have people think that bloggers are so/so writers who just type out a stream of consciousness about what they had for breakfast. They're actively trying to carry that definition over to bloggers who really are a form of journalist.

They don't even want to pay journalists much these days, so they sure as heck don't want to pay bloggers. And unfortunately, if they're dealing with a woman, they know that women won't always ask for what their work is worth.

There are a hell of a lot of bloggers out there, but there aren't a lot of quality bloggers out there. Companies want quality writing on their blogs. That's what draws in readers and that's what keeps them. And quality is always worth paying for.

Megan

Megan Smith

BlogHer CE, TV/Online Video

My Personal Blog:
Megan's Minute

I agree

Ms. Debris — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 09:17:00 -0500

What a great forum. I've learned alot!

Cheers, Holly

Monetizing art and expectations

alvenable — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 23:05:47 -0500

This discussion is not that dissimilar from the ongoing discussion within the music industry on dealing with the Internet and the easy availability of electronic music files for which a user may or may not have paid. Whenever you monetize an art, there will be those who say "Give it all away" for the broader reach, while others will say, "Wait a minute, I need to pay my rent."

You can have the expectation of being paid for your work, but you also have to make a convincing argument to a company as to why they should be paying for the service.

In my mind, there are two types of bloggers, the first group are those who seek opportunities to blog with a financial goal in mind, and the other group consists of those who blog because they enjoy the medium. In that second group, you'll easily find a few examples of people who have turned blogging into a living, but for the majority, that isn't front of mind.

But in those cases, it does involve giving away some of that "free milk," before any finanicial gain is received.

Ultimately, it's up to each person to decide what they want to get out of blogging. Is it to take home a paycheck, or to express your point of view to the largest audience possible.

A. L. Venable is a Random Citizen. She primarily writes at Dimple and a Smirk (dot) com and Our PDX Network.

Blogging for free: Would you do it?

HeatherB — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:39:30 -0500

So about a year ago I began to do something that other bloggers might consider to be most sinful: I started blogging on another site for free.

I know! Try to remove your jaw from the floor while I give my reasons for taking up this opportunity because it wasn't the first time and let's face it, it probably won't be the last time.

It's flattering when people enjoy your somewhat flippant attitude towards subject matter that others might take very seriously (*straightens up and fixes Windsor knot*). But for me personall as a blogger, it's something that has slowly evolved from being up in arms/the world will implode type attitude to somewhat chill. And it was that style of honesty that compelled a website to ask me to write about my work life and personal finance again from the 20 something perspective. But for free. I said yes because SOMEONE LIKES ME! THEY REALLY LIKE ME. And did it once a month for a while and then quit because it was like doing double duty and another place *ahem* was paying me really well to do just that. So while it was great and a bit heady for awhile, I stepped down.

Then came the second opportunity. I have a hobby that I enjoy. Two friends are proprietors of a site where I can write freely - and with the same cheeky attitude - about my hobby. And so when they extended an offer for me to write there, I said yes. Despite the lack of money, I justified it by the click throughs I would get to my site thus increasing my ad revenue as well as the fact that it gave me an excuse to enjoy this hobby every week. Alone. And there's nothing I enjoy more than having a good reason to be a misanthrope. Also the amount of time that I actually spent doing the writing - which is the hard part - is roughly 30 minutes. In my world, it seemed like an excellent opportunity. For the record, it's a job that I have no intention of giving up at any point in the near future.

Though there are times when I become understandably frustrated and throw my hands in the air while asking God why oh why, I decided to do this there has never been a moment when I've felt like one unpaid blogging gig is selling my soul the devil. Perhaps it's the narcissist in me that doesn't mind the extra exposure and pocket change. For these are the same reasons for why when most people ask for me to guest post for them, I usually say yes. It's always a chance to put your name out there and then to do something different with your writing. Also I blog for free at a place that isn't a fortune 500 company and it's once a week compared to others who are doing it daily. For me, I'm fine with my freelancing lot in life.

There is the flip side though. There always is. Huge conglomerates that don't pay bloggers and feel that it's OK not to pay these bloggers because by virtue of the HUGENESS of the site, that blogger will inevitably be on a trajectory towards Web 2.0 popularity. Just today I heard that Today.com pays bloggers $1 per post and are proud of this because they're helping bloggers get their voices heard. Huffington Post - which I just found out recently - doesn't pay their bloggers either and is a site entirely run by free bloggers who they never intend to pay. Then again, I know of a few bloggers there who have had stories picked up by mainstream media sites. But is that enough compensation for the hours spent on a blog post?

Tmainstream media AND new media sometimes aren't too keen on paying their writers because they truly believe that these bloggers are the little guy and by allowing a blogger on their site for free, is actually a very virtuous thing that they're doing; feels so very condescending. Look at this favor I am doing for you! Thank me! While understandable that someone would pick up a free blogging gig here and there, the fact that larger media outlets (US News is another example) seem to ostensibly be using bloggers, makes my blood boil.

But I'm in a different spot. I don't rely on my freelancing for my only source of income. I don't feel as if I have to run out and find the jobs wherever on the basis of exposure because I still have my day job to go to. Now if the tables were turned and I was a freelancer? Would I be a little less ornery about the whole thing? Probably. Because in the grand scheme of things getting your name out there is getting your name out there. A free blogging gig is like an internship. I interned twice in college for free and guess what? It helped my career immensely.

This is the choice that bloggers/freelancers need to make for themselves. They need to figure out how much they are worth and if the benefit of the position in question is worth it for them in the long and/or short run. Jennifer at Network Blogging Tips has written a how-to on calculating your blogging rate. Besides your relative worth think about the position. To write a once a week movie review for free is far different from managing a site for $7 an hour. Read, Write, Web has a great post on how much top tier bloggers and social media consultants are making. Gawker has a post on what free bloggers are giving up for blogging when they 'give up' their content and Network blogging tips also asks how low will you go in blogging wages.

The latter is exactly what I'm asking here except in a more roundabout way because it's rude for me to be all up in your grill asking "So? How much do YOU make?". But the question isn't how much but more what do you think you are worth? Would you ever blog for free? What would make it worth it to you?

Heather B. blogs for what might as well be free at No Pasa Nada.