BlogHer - Single Motherhood - Comments

great post

keyster94 — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:18:25 -0500

You hit so many great points. It's not that white people have it easy when their teens get knocked up, it depends on where they are from. If they are Southern teens, then they get the banjo music and questions about incest. I do agree that in general, "minorities" are treated more like trash though. You mentioned the push for Norplant and whatnot, but don't forget that there was a time when there was an attempt at sterilization of black women in the US. Through the water. It's not a conspiracy theory, it's a flat out conspiracy that took place.

~Kelly

http://www.30somethingandsearching.today.com/

If Bristol was Obama's daughter

danniep29 — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 19:31:27 -0500

If Bristol was Obama's daughter I don't think that everyone would be so set on making sure that her pregnancy stayed a "private matter". Although Obama has taken the high road and made it clear that families are not fair game during the election, I can't help but think that if one of Obama's daughters were old enough to be sexually active and were in Bristol's shoes, people would not be so easy on them. They would become one of the stereotypical "welfare queens" that you speak about in your post. Maybe it's just me...or maybe other people feel that way too.

And btw Laina, good idea to reach out to your niece. She'll need people in her corner who love her and support her now more than ever.

~Dannie P

"When you're walking in your purpose the universe will conspire for your success."

Check out my blog "Clearly Danielle" at http://clearlydanielle.blogspot.com/

Ouch!

Yvette Perry — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:00:33 -0500

Yes, kazari, that is a clever headline. But incorrect (though unintentionally), I think. Hopefully it is the owners of the ovens who are teenagers, not the buns in them. (Imagine that delivery! LOL)

Six Impossible Things Before Breakfast

The missing link

Yvette Perry — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 11:59:04 -0500

I agree that there has been a lot of hypocrisy surrounding this pregnancy issue. However, I think a missing piece of the conversation involves economics.

Some conservatives will say that it is not (minority) unwed childbearing that is objectionable, but the "taxpaying public" having to pick up the tab for these poor choices. Now there are all sorts of problems with that stance as well, but it at least illustrates the way in which economics have always been tied to the public stance on childbearing by women of color--particularly African American women. Of course, in different times, these same healthy, young (and yes--unwed, since they were not allowed to wed) Black women would have been encouraged to bear children. In fact, their continued productivity was necessary to the productivity of the young nation. (Similarly, at other times there have been calls for more White childbearing, for example out of fears of non-Whites becoming too populous, with reproduction by the White and genetically fit being tied to "patriotic duty"...)

Many have written on this far more eloquently than I could ever express. It is jsut important for us to remember in our conversations about race, class, familial status and reproduction that money is tied up in all this very tightly.

Six Impossible Things Before Breakfast

Bravo!

Debra Collins — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 10:02:36 -0500

I enjoyed the issues you raised and the discussion surrounding your post. I have no brillant insights, but as someone who has worked at numerous health agencies in urban environments, (including a 0-3 clinic) there are definate double standards applied to young women/teens of color having babies. This includes the medical community as well. It is unfortunate and unfair, but your observation is accurate.

I also share your thoughts on teen marriage. Teens have unprotected sex and do other high risk behaviors because they can have difficulty making appropriate decisions for themselves. More and more developmental research is determining that there is a wider gap than previously believed and this complicates all sorts of issues; when can someone really stand trial as an adult? What should be the legal age for drinking, voting, or being allowed to sign up for the military? So, can a teen really be expected to make a good marital partnership decision?

Because I take a systems psychological approach, I do believe that families live out patterns. This is mostly done subconsciously and sometimes it is not, but I think if we as a country want to reduce teen or unplanned pregnancies we need to do way more education about the "why'"; not just safe sex practices.

Excellent!

Nordette — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:52:20 -0500

Laina, I enjoyed the personal side of this story/article and your cogency on the Palin pregnacy issue. I believe you'll appreciate Jon Stewart's clips on the hypocrisy going around. :-) The Rove and Bill O'Reilly parts really got me.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Best Palin headline yet!!!!!

kazari — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:17:40 -0500

I'm not gonna vote, I'm not even American, and I'm apologising in advance for interrupting this very serious thread, but I felt the need to share the following headline:

Palin pregnancy helps turn up heat on teenage buns in ovens

That is a FOR REAL headline on a FOR REAL newspaper website.

Please continue with your regularly scheduled political discussion.

I think I have a recipe for that...

More thanks

Suzanne Reisman — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:12:52 -0500

I've been fuming about all the points you both made, especially that "Baby Mama" bullshit. The lack of respect accorded to a grown, accomplished woman is disgusting on its own, yet contrasted with how extra respectful everyone has been of this situation, it just illustrates the true lows of our culture and its abuse of race when it suits the powers that be.

Suzanne Reisman, Contributing Editor - Feminism & Gender
Campaign for Unshaved Snatch (CUSS) & Other Rants

Thanks For Sharing Your Very Personal Story

Megan Smith — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 20:25:46 -0500

Thank you, thank you for pointing out every bit of hypocriscy about the whole Bristol Palin pregnancy. I've been thinking about this for days and spewing about it to anyone who would listen, because it's just so obvious.

If Barack Obama's 17 year old daughter was unmarried and five months pregnant, does any honest person really think that she would be treated with the same warm and fuzzy kid gloves the Republican Party is using for Bristol Palin? Even if it was announced that Obama's 17 year old was marrying the father of her baby?

No, she would be vilified.

For proof, just look at how Michelle Obama's been treated. Remember Michelle as Barack's "Baby Mama?" And she's Obama's wife, not his 17 year old pregnant and unmarried daughter.

It's times like these that the Republican party, their right wing religious fanatics, and their "fair and balanced" shills, can make me quite ill.

Megan Smith
BlogHer Contributing Editor, TV/YouTube
Megan's Minute: Quirky Commentary Around The Clock

L16, Thanks. That is very

miteegirl — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 19:46:36 -0500

L16,

Thanks. That is very kind. I've enjoyed posts from many people on here, on both sides of the issues.

I think I'm struggling with the fact that I was sure that they meant it when they said that this would be a more civil campaign this time around.

But what would all of those pundits do if they weren't paid to be indignant and outraged? It's their only skillset.

We would have all of those outraged pundits out of work, shuffling around cloaked in their righteous indignation, the outraged pundit industry in chaos since manufactured outrage is propping up the value of overall outrage right now. It would be an outrage recession and that would be...,um, bad?

Okay, I'll stop now. I need to step away from the computer for awhile (half the board sighs in relief). Wake me up when McCain comes on.

Oh wait, McCain is already working the pre-speech circuit. Here's the headline that I just pulled from the feed:

McCain vows to end partisan rancor in Washington

Someone might want to tell Palin, Thompson and Guiliani. I don't think they got that memo.

Miteegirl, I keep reading

L16 — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 18:57:32 -0500

Miteegirl,

I keep reading posts where I nod and nod and go ummhmm and then I get to the bottom and your name is on it! You are a good read for when I need to get my blood pressure under control from all my reading, and youtubing and CNNing etcetera.

What I am getting out of the past couple weeks is that tolerance is such an incredible character trait that I need to work on. You know who is a cool cucumber though? For shiz it is Barack Obama. I think he may be the only one in America who doesn't have hate spewing out of him at this point. I am waiting to see if he snaps. I mean seriously everyone is losing their minds! Absolutely everyone. I feel like America needs a really good cry and a hug.

Semicolon, Not that

miteegirl — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 18:52:32 -0500

Semicolon,

Not that hypocrisy.

The other kind.

The kind where the Conservative Right has railed on unwed teens for decades, sneering at them and implying that their parents couldn't control them.

Bill O'Reilly calling the parents of a pregnant teen "pinheads" and condeming Glouchester High School for letting teens get pregnant and "out of control".

The kind were the Conservative Right has wanted to withhold funding for social programs for pregnant teens or sex education and wants to outlaw abortion or giving birth control to teens. I belive the sentiment has been something like, "Well, it's their own fault if they get pregnant! Why should WE have to pay for their kid?"

The hypocrisy that it is now okay for a well off, WHITE girl to be a pregnant teen. But not a poor girl.

That kind of hypocrisy.

You know, the kind we hear when we hang out with some (some, not all) Evangelical Christians.

And I know about this, because I am one.

Business is Business

Bill Cammack — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 18:20:00 -0500

Nice article, Lainad.

This whole Palin thing has clearly thrown EVERYONE for a loop, and people are scrambling left and right to spin things they didn't think they were going to have to deal with.

The fact of the matter is that now that Sarah Palin has been selected to potentially become the first female U.S. Vice President, and then, most likely, the first female PotUS, everything about her needs to be washed clean. So.. Naturally, people are going to make illogical stretches and bend reality in order to convince themselves and hopefully all of the voting public that the Emperor actually DOES have clothes on.

They don't have the luxury of speaking poorly of Bristol Palin, because it would reflect poorly on Sarah Palin and then reflect poorly on John McCain. There's the business of securing an election at hand, which is way more important than fairly criticizing people, to the writers you're talking about in your post.

The thing about this is that this is ANOTHER amazing stumbling block for the Republicans. Besides not selecting any one of myriad more qualified women as a running mate, they now have to damage-control images of her daughter which feature drinking, guns and partying.

Regardless of how they spin it, the VP position is very important in case the President is no longer able to serve. The President is going to need to be able to "control stuff". The Democrats are going to have a field day with this, just like Lynne Spears' parenting book deal went out the window after TWO of the daughters she parented ended up rather pregnant, rather unmarried and rather publicly discussed.

So this is why they have to spin this situation. To speak negatively of the Palin situation implies that she can't control her own kids. If she can't control her kids, how can she be expected to run the country, just in case?

Is it fair? No. Is it hypocritical for people to criticize the same situation differently when it happens to different people? Yes. At this point, business is business, and they have to roll with McCain's choice and make the best of it.

~ Bill
I blog at billcammack.com

Thanks everyone!

lainad — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 18:13:51 -0500

And thank you, Semicolon, for your comments. But I wonder, and maybe I am completely wrong about this, are the young couple getting married because of their decision, or are they being forced to because of their parents, most notably Sarah Palin's political career and reputation?

I admit, I have very negative views on marriage (my friends who read this are probably nodding their heads and laughing) but while I would rather a child be born in wedlock, I simply wonder if these kids are too young. Do they love each other enough to make / take those vows seriously? I feel a bit sorry for this dude - I'm pretty sure that his thought process during his relationship was to have fun, not have an instant family at 18. Maybe it is not really worth it for the child for their parents to be married - maybe it is just better for Bristol to raise the child on her own instead of being trapped in a situation that is not right for her - her parents maybe, but not her.

Maybe it is none of my business!!

Contributing Editor - Race, Ethnicity & Culture

Writing is Fighting: www.lainad.typepad.com

Hypocrisy?

Semicolon — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 17:44:42 -0500

I am one of those evangelical conservatives who's being accused of hypocrisy in this situation. I don't think you understand where we are on this issue.

First of all, I believe that sex outside of marriage is wrong. Therefore, I believe that Bristol and her boyfriend and your niece and her boyfriend made a bad decision and a morally wrong one.

However, the baby that is one of the results of that decision did nothing wrong. What's more, the babies' parents, although they were wrong to conceive the children involved, made a good decision in not cutting off the lives that had already begun. Nobody's "applauding" Bristol Palin's decision to have sex outside of marriage. I am applauding her decision, and that of her boyfriend, to accept responsibility for their actions and for the new life that has been formed.

Make no mistake, the majority of parents in the history of the world have been Bristol Palin's age or younger. She and her fiance have the support of family, and they will be just fine. At least, that's what people of good will would wish for her and her family. ANd I pray that your niece is able to form a family and enjoy the baby that she has been blessed with, too.