BlogHer - affair - Comments

Justification -- we all do it

BarbD — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 06:02:35 -0500

It's a hard road in our society to garner sympathy for an affair -- you're right. And believe it or not, after many years of dealing with infidelity, both personally and through my years participating on an online divorce support group, I've developed a much more nuanced view of the topic.

There are many outcomes to affairs, including the affair partners starting a new life together. Even when this happens, though, it comes at the expense of others' lives. For every spouse who's happy to end his or her marriage, there are many more who are blindsided and must deal with the end of their lives as they know them, struggling to catch up to how they went from married to divorced in (what feels like to them) 0 to 60 mph. When there are children, the complications and pain multiply exponentially.

Even if you're not interested in a long-term relationship, if it's found out, stuff can happen. It can get very unpleasant -- for everyone.

I get that people meet someone and fall in love. When that happens, we're capable of justifying all kinds of things we might never believe we could possibly accept. I'm still uncomfortable with a love that excludes knowledge of it from the unsuspecting spouse, who's entitled to have a choice, too.

No

TellEmGirl — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 22:31:52 -0500

No, no, no. I would not say that they PREFER men in relationships, BUT they are definitely attracted to a man who can commit.

I am a single woman, so I know the feeling. I have been involved with men who were in serious relationships, one guy was married. Honestly, these relationships were more passionate, fun, and definitely steamier than other relationships. They were also lonelier, unstable, and more guilt-ridden than any other relationship. As a result, I also developed a feeling of unworthiness about myself. For that reason, I chose not to be involved with anyone else's man ever again.

I've had conversations with many women who have had similar relationships and everyone pretty much felt the same way, which is why I don't think single women prefer these men unless they have their own agenda. Most single women looking for a man, want a man they can call their own. My personal opinion is that women who desperate to find this type of love, settle for the "next best thing", a part-time lover. How many times have you heard the saying "I'd rather have half of a man, than no man at all"?

Loving a Married Man

lisamaggard — Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:15:07 -0500

I have learned that most of what we think about infidelity comes from a set of societal standards we happen to follow. And then I fell in love with a married man. About that time I was reading "Loving Frank" and came upon a line in that book which I will paraphrase: Everyone always feels so sorry for the wife when a man has an affair. But what about the two people who have found one another and can't be together? Why don't we feel sorry for the futility of their love? (That is a loose paraphrase, and I apologize for it but I lent my copy of the book to a friend and can't look up the exact words right now.) But the idea hit me over the head at the time--we automatically think, "Oh the poor wife!" and forget that maybe, just maybe, the two people who are having the affair, that 'cad' of a married man and that 'hussy' of a mistress just happen to have incredibly bad timing but an incredible love for one another. That is a situation worthy of our pity as well, is it not?

Something else I have learned is that until you have walked a mile in someone else's shoes, do not assume you understand anything about his or her life. It is so easy to say, "Tell me it isn't true! I'm so disappointed in you both!" but have you really considered what it is like to be that person or those people? Nothing is as simple as 'such and such is always wrong.' Instead, the older I get the more gray and hazy are my ideas of right and wrong. There are simply so many factors to consider that judging an affair with a "one size fits all mentality" is shallow-minded and unfair to all parties involved.

Women like a challenge. that's all

omgchronicles — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 08:52:25 -0500

I don't think women like unavailablility; they like a man who is a tad challenging and engaging and, yes, we love a man who shows he's able of commitment, and what better than a married man? (except, if he acts on it, of course; we seem to ignore THAT part!)

But, as Barb says, there are many ways to have a loving committed relationship that don't look like man, woman, kids, house. After I divorced, I started to fall into that routine again — looking for a man to replicate what I had — until I realized, heck, I don't really want that anymore! So, my BF of 4-plus years and I see each other when I don't have my kids and when he doesn't have his daughter, and then he goes to his house or I go to mine and we talk on the phone in between. It's part mistress, part wife.

I don't need to be "wife" again to have a loving, committed relationship. Maybe that's what some women are experiencing right now; they like the freedom and the love.

The problem with infidelity, as others mention above, is that not all parties involved have knowledge and are in agreement about what's going on. As a woman who once cheated and who has been cheated upon, let me tell you, that part sucks!

oops

omgchronicles — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 08:51:57 -0500

I meant, "I don't think women like unavailablility .."

But, you knew that ;-)

Agreed

Bill Cammack — Mon, 24 Aug 2009 09:32:31 -0500

IMO, that's PRECISELY what it is, Sarah. The guy who walks in the door available and interested doesn't "mean anything" as far as the woman asserting herself or actively attracting him. OTOH, if he's NOT available and she bags him, she's achieved something special.

This is where "Nice Guys Finish Last" comes from, since the guys who bend over backwards to be nice to women are often stuck in the "Friend Zone", because they really don't light her fire. She sees them as someone to fall back on when nothing else is happening, but not as someone to really team up and make a run at a relationship with.

It's also the reason why it's in a guy's best interest to act like there's something special about a gal that attracted him to her. If you just walk in the door sweating her for her looks and knowing nothing about her personality or achievements, a lot of time, she figures you're "just trying to get some", as opposed to having actually been smitten by seeing her for the first time in life.

There's nothing wrong with this syndrome, but it's definitely used as a great advantage by guys who pretend to be disinterested in order to get the woman to hop into gear and do the right thing.

~ Bill
I blog at billcammack.com

I've had an affair with a

AnnQuirk — Mon, 24 Aug 2009 07:48:36 -0500

I've had an affair with a Married man before....while I agree married men have the attraction of having made a committment, part of the issue (I think) is when you're working full time and get to a certain level in your career, most of the men are a bit older and Married.

And that's who you spend all day, every day, with. Plus you have a lot in commo, perhaps more than people have with someone they may have married 10 - 15 years ago, so that additional attraction is defintiely there.

When I had my affair, I wan't looking for anything permanent. That in mind, I also think men are attracted to married women for the same reason.

Additonally, married women and men are going to be more relaxed and not seem "desperate", as so many single people do.

I also think it's human nature to go after what other people have.....kind of a competetive thing.

sadly ... yes

sarahday — Thu, 20 Aug 2009 12:41:25 -0500

I'm almost ashamed to admit this but I agree with you Bill. For some reason us women are attracted to unavailability. It might not be the "married man", instead it is the bad boy or the emotionally unavailable one. I think often it has a lot to do with self worth (ironic... I know) than emotional intimacy. "If the unavailable guy that shouldn't love me loves me, then I am special" vs. the guy completely willing to love you, because how do you know he wouldn't love anyone.

Sarah Day

live large, laugh often, wear purple underwear

house of day

Unavailability

Bill Cammack — Wed, 19 Aug 2009 03:33:14 -0500

There are really two things at play here. The first one is that women love guys that are unavailable in general. "Taken" or "Spoken For" is just one flavor of "Unavailable". It gives y'all something to do. Women love to make changes to situations. The guy that's sweating you, is... sweating you *yawn*. A guy that's unavailable, you get the chance to make him your own and feel accomplished.

The second thing is that women take advice from other women. Chris Rock said, basically, "When a guy sees a guy with a good gal, he wants a gal just like her. When a gal sees another gal with a good guy, she wants THAT GUY!" :D

The fact that he's "settled down" with a gal means that.... hold on to your hats... He's the type of guy TO settle down. It's a trait women are looking for. Also, being that some woman hooked up with him in a LTR, that means she did the due diligence of vetting him already.

So, being "Taken", or at least appearing so, makes it easier to get women.. not tougher. Taking it back out to the general.. Being unavailable makes women throw themselves at you, while if you had approached them as if you want them, they'd deal with you entirely differently and you'd have a much harder time getting on.

Also, women 'give it up' faster when they feel like they don't have a chance with you. :D

~ Bill
I blog at billcammack.com

Infidelity is inexcusable

bacc02 — Tue, 18 Aug 2009 14:46:55 -0500

I have to agree with Barb above. I'm sure it is all fun and games for the cheaters but it is most likely torture and hell for the unknowing significant other.

While I understand the psychology behind women being attracted to a man who is labeled "taken" in the context of them being "domesticated" or "worthy," I have to wonder what the affect would be if you changed the test. If they said, this man is in a relationship and cheats on his wife. Suddently, the attraction would be completely gone. Nobody respects someone who cheats on their spouce.I'm sure it's fun and exciting to be breaking the rules, but, ultimatel, it is at someone else's expense.

"To a wife, you talk about money. You talk about critical decisions. You
talk about layoffs and pay cuts. To a mistress, you talk about
philosophy and literature, you talk about the color of the ocean and
the deepest secrets of your heart."

This entire philosophy of being a mistress to get the "good parts" of a relationship without all of the baggage is rubbish. If a marriage is only based on a business partnership, then it really isn't a marriage at all. All of those things you listed in the mistress category should be in the marriage category or something is already wrong and needs to be adressed by the married couple. If you're missing something in your marriage, it is your responsibility to address it with your partner, not to find a willing participant to fill the void. And then, if you start sharing that part of yourself and your emotions with another person, how do you think that makes your partner feel?

I'm sure it sounds harsh and simplistic, but I really don't see any justification for infidelity. If you are missing something from your marriage, you should own up to it and work it out with your partner. If you both decide the best course is to look outside your marriage (swinging, etc), then I'm all for it. The difference is CONSENT.

Why can't women find the same freedom with a single man?

BarbD — Mon, 17 Aug 2009 08:20:22 -0500

I don't mean this in a judgmental way. I'm a midlifer who has been divorced for 12 years and has been in a long-term relationship for the past 3+. We spend week-ends together and take a couple of trips a year but otherwise, it's a "same city, different houses" kind of relationship. I'm open to more, but am just as happy with what we have now.

One of the reasons my marriage ended was my ex's infidelity. As it turns out, it wasn't the most important reason, and I realized not long into our separation that it was the excuse I needed to end a very bad marriage.

An open relationship is not for me but I'm fine with other couples who make that choice. What bothers me about the situations you describe is that one person has had a choice made for her (or him, because this happens to men, too) without her knowledge. And I know firsthand the devastation learning about this most intimate of betrayals can create in a relationship.

What for your friends is a carefree, uncomplicated relationship is anything but to the unsuspecting party who they (selfishly?) don't consider. I guess I can't imagine going through my life with so little consideration for the consequences my behavior might have on others.

Barb

Wow.

MizSmith — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 12:56:09 -0500

I absolutely loved reading this. Everything you said is so true. I ended my marriage four years ago and removing the ring was the biggest relief I felt in a long time. I wanted the disconnecton. He was dead weight for me and I knew I could never get what I needed in life with him around. We were young and grew into two very different people. I enjoy growing and challenging myself and he's content being exactly where he is.

My new relationship isn't the greatest and I've dealt with his infidelities. But theres something more in our relationship that made it worth sticking out. I believe we cannot find everything we want in just one person. We've never had the discussion about his affair so to speak, but I'd like to know what he feels I was lacking. Either way there are many times I'd love to have an affair myself. Find what I'm missing from him else where. Fortuantely for my family I have more self control but the temptation is always there. It's just like you said, it's always on his terms, his schedule, his time. What about my plans, my schedule and my time?

www.MizSmith.com

Cheating

oigeli — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 21:37:08 -0500

Is Your Partner Cheating?

http://digg.com/people/voiceBubble_Is_Your_Partner_Cheating

Having It All

laurie percival — Tue, 21 Apr 2009 18:57:36 -0500

"What if you can't have a best friend and a passionate love and a tryant and doting husband all in one?"

I have one of those really rare and special relationships with my husband. Where I do have a best friend and doting husband who is also a passionate lover.

[ducks from books being hurled at her from other readers]

I realize that the relationship that I have is rare because I only know one other couple that has it. We have found what works for us and revel in it, but what keeps our relationship strong is the communication and desire we both have to immerse ourselves into each others lives. When you lead very seperated lives, it's hard to make the connections that you really need in order to create a strong bond with someone.

This article is extremely touching, heartbreaking and probably maddening for some, but it is full of truth. Most people do not find all that they are looking for in one person, one relationship. I used to get very upset when I would hear about people cheating. Why not break up or get divorced, I would say. To assume that I knew the intricacies of that person's relationship and what would be best for them was naive. I understand now that marriage, like life is not simple or easy. There is no equation that you can apply to ensure a perfect relationship. Unfortunately more often than not, You + Me does not = Happily Every After.

I wish you the best with your future fires; don't let them completely consume you until you have everything you want.

The disconnect isn't the worst bit, its the ONLY bit.

kazari — Tue, 21 Apr 2009 02:21:27 -0500

Everything else is logistics or practicalities.

The disconnect, is almost impossible to acknowledge, then almost impossible to ignore.

That whole separate schedules thing, the disconnect - we did that. Maybe we're still doing that. But right now he's come home, and we're trying to work it.

It's been... isolating, heart-breaking, grief-inducing... but still, we are trying. I think we can put it back together. I don't know how long it will take.

The first question, i guess - do you want to fix it?