Father Adult Lesbian Daughter Moment, Will It Ever Change
by no_I_am_zoe

One of the benefits of working for your father's company is that you get to see your dad every day. One of the down sides of working for your father's company is that you have to see your dad every day. Working for the family business is not for everyone. Not only does it require you to compartmentalize your family relationship, because who really wants to talk shop during Thanksgiving dinner, but you also have to realize that becoming and remaining your own adult person can be much more difficult when the person you call dad signs your paychecks and approves your vacations time.

Not to mention that there sometimes are no lines between personal and professional.

Over the years , I have learned that when my dad gets to talking about religion or politics, I should just let him say what he has to say and not argue with him. I generally hesitate to agree with him because our reasons or arguments for whatever it is we are agreeing upon, are usually vastly different, and of course my reasoning is always wrong. I usually try to contain myself, and not say much, I find it's best that way. But every once in a while, he pushes my buttons ( the gay ones) and I just can't not say something, which usually ends in me pushing his buttons (the catholic church ones). Today was button pushing day.

Around 5:00 this evening, my dad popped in and started talking to me. He asked me if I had written my (this) post yet. I said no. He asked if I knew what I was going to write about. I said no. He then said, "well I had some ideas for topics for you." I knew this wasn't going to be good, and immediately thought to myself, 'what the hell was thinking telling my parents that I write for BlogHer.' All I said in response was (in a this outta be good kind of tone) "oh?" He went on to tell me that I should write about why gay people are so unhappy.

I took a deep a breath, and told myself not to react. Mental health is certainly a good and important topic, but, that's not exactly what he said, nor was it what he meant. There was a lot implied in that statement, not the least of which (and I may just be sensitive and the implication wasn't really intended, but I think it was) was a jab at Betty Please who suffers from anxiety and depression and just recently went through a pretty rough time. Also implied was, if we (gay people) only all followed the teachings of the catholic church, then we'd all be happy. So the last bit was my own inference because my dad is like a broken record about the church, it's his answer to everything. Converts are the most passionate about their religion.

After collecting my thoughts, I started by pointing out that you can't say all gay people are unhappy, that's just untrue. I mean, generally speaking I'm pretty happy. Then I pointed out that there is going to be the same percentage of the gay population as is in the rest of the population who has an inherited form of depression and anxiety, like Betty Please does, which has nothing to do with her sexuality. Now, I won't argue that there is probably a larger proportion of the gay population who suffer from depression and anxiety that is more of a situational form than those in the general population, but really, do the reasons for this need explanation? Does it really take a rocket scientist to understand that if you marginalize peoples relationships, tell them they are less than, call them names, threaten them, torment them, discriminate against them, ostracize them, force them to stay hidden in the closet, or withhold family support, that perhaps that might cause one just a little unhappiness?

My dad did not want to accept that gay people were ever treated poorly by others, to which I had to argue that just because he has not witnessed it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. That because I am lucky enough to be able fly under the radar in the straight world, doesn't mean everyone is as lucky. He then said, "well those people bring it on themselves then." That last statement just about made me furious. I replied with, "so, you think that those people should conform to what you want so that you'll be comfortable, rather than them be who they are and be happy? Let me tell you something dad, no one would choose to be this way if they really weren't, and no amount of Jesus is going change that." See, there's me, poking at the church button. I tried not to, but it was beckoning me.

He started to back pedal a bit and say that it wasn't the catholics who had the ex-gay programs, that it's okay to be gay and catholic as long as you're celibate. I couldn't help but say that that wasn't gonna happen, and I didn't imagine that he would chose to be celibate either if someone tried to impose it on his marriage. Then the argument turned to, well it's really that you're not married, and since you're not married the church requires celibacy...Ah but of course, same-sex marriage won't ever be allowed in the catholic church, because really it is about being gay.

As you can imagine this went on for while, but I actually feel like it was a small victory for me. I stood my ground as an adult, I didn't back down, and didn't fall back into being his child, which given the complexity of the dynamic we have, that's progress. With my dad, it's not ever going to be him coming around to my point of view, but rather that he respects that I have one and it's my own. We agree to disagree.

I know I don't have it as bad as some. My parents include us both in their life. I just wish they would be a little more conscious of the things they say. I know not everyone can have a mother like Connie Van Dyke who wrote

The fact that he or she is gay takes away nothing from the priceless life you brought into the world. It is another facet of who your child is and another piece of the magnificent puzzle that is life.

as part of an Open Letter to Mothers of a Gay or Lesbian Child, but I wish I did.

 

I'm sure it can't be easy for a parent to come to terms with having a gay child. When Debbie found out that one of her sons was gay and the other bisexual, she decided to start a support website and blog, Gay Family Support Blog, for other parents of gay children. Of course there's also PFLAG in the US and FFLAG in UK.

I'll leave you with one last thought from The Venus of Willendork's post, Rainbow Brite vs. The (not so) Religious Right

I haven't exactly managed to avoid the reality that homophobia still runs rampant in society and that it often disguises itself as religion. (I did, somewhat accidentally, attend a Catholic university. I do have an extended family that considers "love the sinner, hate the sin" the hallmark of tolerance and prays every Sunday for my speedy recovery from, you know, loving people with the wrong chromosomal pair.) Still, every time I encounter homophobia, I respond like it's some new beast, or rather an old one I thoroughly expected would be extinct by now, and after the fury cools (or starts transforming itself into material for the next short story/ slam/ et cetera), I'm left confounded by the fact that people are still holding onto this.

 

I know my parents will never change. I just wish they would.

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Comments

 

You Can Borrow My Mom

And dad.  My sister is a born-again Southern Baptist, so  I totally get your comment:

Converts are the most passionate about their religion.

You made quote of the day on my blog with that one.

Elisa DelBonis
aquestionofperspective.com

 

Everyone I have ever known

Everyone I have ever known who has converted to a new religion became absolutely absorbed it.  I'm not sure why that happens.  

I'm honored to make your quote of the day.  And, thanks for the offer to borrow your folks. 

 

I'll give that a go...

along with some overall thoughts on your opening post.

I was raised Catholic. Attended a French Catholic grammar school, 8 years worth. First Friday of every month, we were marched off to church. Summer months, we were outside saying prayers. (one year, students were dropping like flies in the heat, just standing there in the bright sun, doing all these prayers.) Ah, I digress.

It never felt right. This parish was a mini-campus; 2 school buildings, the church, home where the nuns lived, home for the 3 then two priests. The home for the priests was twice the size of the home for 20 nuns. The nuns did everything themselves, the priests had hired staff (2 I believe.)

By the time I was in college, there was an open break, church and me were at odds. I took my beliefs private, stayed Christian. I never thought on it much, not for almost 30 years, but there was a lot of things ingrained in me that worked in subtle ways, and basically I stayed Christian throughout those 30 years. And starting 6 years ago, it all began to change.

What I found was something that did feel right, that fit my outlook, fit my life, that had asked the same questions and sometimes carried the same experiences - for Sue Monk Kidd. And reading her experiences rocked my world.

Reiki has followed, another element of things.

And so my guess is people are passionate about their new beliefs precisely because they have moved toward them. The attraction has to be strong to pull away from old beliefs, old beliefs which in my case carried a whole lot of guilty feelings for feeling a pull elsewhere. I faced that head on, and overcame.

I'm pretty sure it would be annoying to face the daily potential for opinion that ran afoul of basic elements of who I am. At one time, I'd have gone toe to toe over these things. Now? I'm just not sure. More likely, I simply remove myself from the unpleasantness, but stay true to me.

I cannot offer any advice, nor do you need any... this is your issue to wrestle.

There has been huge change over the last decade; huge. With every person who comes out, more people rethink old attitudes based on what they know of the person newly out. If it becomes unbearable, I'd start looking for other employment... this might save your sanity, and improve family relations. :)

Best wishes! 

 

 

nelle

&

llhaesa

 

Family ties are always complicated

It's complicated enough for me - I can't imagine being in your place. Or, I can imagine it a little better now after I've read this post. 

"Gay people are unhappy" - that's a highly provocative statement. He was obviously trying to push your gay buttons with that one. I'm glad you stood your ground. 

Vered DeLeeuw

http://momgrind.com/

 

I'm sure every everyone has

I'm sure every everyone has their own issues with family, mine just happens to be that I'm gay and an atheist. Most of the time we get along just fine, until my dad starts in.  I'm sure I'll never understand why he does it.  You know.  I mean, I respect them enough as people to not antagonize them about religion, so why bait me into an argument? 

Thanks for confirming that he was pushing my buttons. 

 

I totally hear ya-I have a similar
situation...

 

I really enjoyed reading your article for many reasons....I have a similar situation with my parents...the catholic/guilt thing is just ridiculous!  I came out almost 2 years ago and have had nothing but rude, narrow-minded comments from my mom....one that will either make you laugh, cry, or both~  she said that maybe my being a lesbian is "contagious!!" That just put the icing on the cake for me....I, too have to hold my ground and I'm definitely getting better at doing so.

You go girl and thanks for the article.....it was an inspiration to me, as well as I'm sure many other gay people out there in the world. 

 

Lori A Gimmer

 

 

 

Well, it does get a little

Well, it does get a little better with time.  I came out to may parents about 13 or 14 years ago and as you can see I still sometimes have to get into it with my folks.  But, for the most part, my mom and dad realized pretty early on that they could either be a part of my life or not, and being a part of my life included my partner as well.  A package deal.  It's not perfect, but they have come a long, long way.

I think the best thing you can do is be confident in who you are, don't back down, and make sure they know that you and your partner are a package deal. You also might want to let them know that saying hurtful things to doesn't do anything but hurt your feeling and drive you further away from them, it's not going to make you not gay.

Good luck.  I hope things improve with your parents. 

 

Not only are my parents catholic

but my brother is a priest. Whoopee! And they worship the ground he walks on. I'm about to come out to them, What funit will be.

Arial

 

This will rock your Daddy!

It was a shock for Peter too when he was asked to visit the home of a Centurian in Acts 10. He was more shocked when the "Holy Spirit" came down upon the Gentiles... This isn't what was suppose to happen! Man did that mess up his day. But he was smart enough to realize that if God, through the Holy Spirit, can recognize goodness then what can he say or do?

Share this link with your Father.

Peace,

Fr. J

http://www.united-catholic-church.org/FAITH/FA%20Theological%20Reflectio...

FA%20TH%20%20Stygles%20%20UCC%20and%20Homosexuality.htm

(you might have to paste both lines together.) 

 

Father John's link...

Here it is clickable

~Denise
BlogHer Community Manager

Flamingo House Happenings

 

Parents, Are Parents, Are Parents

It's funny, when I read the part in your post where you talk about the buttons parents know to push, I thought about my own parental head butting. 

The topic can be about almost anything that my mother feels she has the right to "instruct" me about, but part of my becoming an adult was being able to say, I love ya' but this topic---pick one---is off the table.  Now let's move on.

Though I must say, I've never had to work for my mother so there, you've got me.

Megan Smith
BlogHer Contributing Editor, TV/YouTube
Megan's Minute: Quirky Commentary Around The Clock

 

I related to your article

I related to your article since I am a gay man who was raised a Christian Fundamentalist.  I am still a Christian, but my beliefs have grown quite progressive over the years thanks to reading and membership in progressive churches. 

My relationship with my mother is, however, a little different than yours with your dad.  She and I have a pretty "don't  ask, don't tell" sort of a relationship.  Imagine a whole part of your life, a pretty big part, I believe, espcially if you regard GBLT people as an oppressed minority and feel a prophetic calling to "resue the oppressed".  Large swaths of my existence are of no interest to my mother.  I have often stated how much I wis she would engage me in conversation on our differences rather than pretending they are not there.  Engaging shows interest, recognizes value and hints to me that you love me.

I wish my mother thought about me as a person with ideas and feelings worthy of discussion and debate.  We don't have to agree ... I'm sure we won't!