The Season of Our Discontent or Life with the "N" Word
by Nordette

Any discusion of the "n" word in mixed company, mingling ethnic groups, gets uncomfortable, maybe even dirty. It'll shake some folks up, maybe burn a few, but if we're lucky, like supernaturally blessed lucky, we might learn something to heal our disease. So, I've set aside the post I'd intended to write about Starbucks closing. Instead I'm picking up a topic that I've told other bloggers privately I won't discuss again until possibly next year, use of the "n" word.

I said wait until next year because you know some drama about the "n" word will blow up again. It's become a fixture in our lives. Toni Morrison's assertion in Playing in the Dark that the African-American presence, either by appearing fully and positively or only as troublesome allusion, permeates American Literature may also be applied to the fabric of this nation. The blood-stained thread weaves through each patch, a pleasing splash of color or embarrasing stain.

First, Laina, thank you for taking on this complex subject. Laina is a BlogHer contributing editor who wrote about America's most recent dust-up over the "n" word, the Whoopi Goldberg/Elisabeth Hasselbeck drama. She's done an exceptional job. I like her pithtiness and how she also drew into the post the Jesse Jackson/Obama mess, a topic that reminds us just how much race has been in our faces this election year. Laina also had the following observation that made me laugh.

Plus, why are white folks so eager to say the N-word in public? It's like y'all chomping at the bit. Good luck with that. (Laina's post)

My problem with the "why can't we white people also use the "n" word because black people say it all the time" justification and then someone like Elisabeth Hasselbeck crying on The View over what, oh what will she teach her children if black people keep calling each other "n****r" is that the argument is bullsh*t. It's like most justifications that come from people who don't want to address a difficult issue honestly; it oversimplifies the subject, "white washes" it so to speak, just to let folks who are too lazy to walk in someone else's shoes off the hook for taking high road.

Really, how dare Hasselbeck make it sound as though black people are at fault for more white people using the "n" word? I'll concede that young white people listening to rap music have been stricken stupid by hearing this word so often, but what does that have to do with what Hasselbeck teaches her children about treating people with respect?

I know I'm treading a slippery slope here and certainly risk being called "an angry black woman," but that's okay. I'll be in good company with Laina and Michelle Obama. We have a tendency in this country to chide people for expressing anger about subjects that any fool knows should make a person angry. When feminists, for instance, passionately speak about the inequality of women, what's the common adjective tossed their way? Hmm, she sure sounds bitter. You may also hear some further discussion about it being her time of the month, or raging hormones from menopause. When black women speak of racial injustice, then it's "they're angry" and also, "You know how emotional those people are. They just don't know how to be rational."

I'm not angry. I'm frustrated.

I'm not so much frustrated by the racist policies and practices that affect African-Americans everyday. I was born into that. It's something you don't get over, but you do learn to adjust. You develop coping mechanisms such as practicing love instead of endulging meltdowns, and you live your life hoping the world will become what it should be. If you're not totally beaten down by the time you bear children, then you embrace the wonders of your heritage, ignore the hateful, and teach your children to behave as people would in a better world.

I am not angry but I am frustrated by people behaving as though they don't understand how some black people may use the word "n****r" sometimes and yet be incensed by people of other races using it. Frankly, this pretense of incomprehension is another form of racist propaganda, this view that black people are so foreign to white people and hard to understand when it comes to the "n" word. Any thoughtful person who takes time for introspection and observation knows that when black people use the "n" word they're exhibiting a common type of human behavior. What complicates the discussion and how we use language and the "n" word is the history of black people in this country, not that black people use it.

Part of the problem may be that some white people deny how much power they've enjoyed in this world, do not wish to consciously grasp the value of having white skin in a society that has historically favored white skin. I can understand how that happens. It's hard to see yourself as powerful when you're struggling to make rent yourself just like the black woman next door. It's hard for some people to put themselves as individuals within the context of centuries of history. So, they tell themselves that if there are any benefits to being white, they personally have not experienced it and so, therefore, have not benefited no matter what Andrew Hacker and those hoity-toity academics think.

Yet, I can't think of a nasty name for white people that non-white people may use that is as ugly as the "n" word. Is this because no matter what nasty name you call a white person (not that I spend time calling white people nasty names) it's understood that they are still "white," and so, have the upper hand?

Consider a joke that got a good laugh the first time African-American comedian Louis Ramey told it on Last Comic Standing. He said that he likes to play practical jokes. He likes to go to tanning salons: "Oh, I don't go in. I just stand outside and do this." Ramey holds his black arms and hands in front of him, widens his eyes, and then screams in terror. "Waaaaaahhhhhh!"

It's understood -- a little color is a good thing. Getting dark enough to be mistaken for a black person is quite another. We may agree that African-Americans have made great strides in this country. Look at this election season alone and the Obamas. But we also know, if we're honest, that for the average black person, life ain't no crystal stair to success. The Obamas, the Oprahs, the Tiger Woodses are exceptions not the rule. Yet, that they exist is a testament not only to their brilliance and perseverance but also to racial progress. When I was a child, there were no Oprahs and being like Obama could've been a death sentence for a black man in some states. (This is where I recommend the curious take a look at CNN's "Black in America" special.)

When I speak of a racial insult that someone could hurl at a white person, I'm talking about a mean word one group ascribes to members of another group no matter the content of a person's character or level of achievement. I'm not talking about personal insults. I've heard whitey, honky, cracker, peckerwood as insults to white people. However, none of these words will start a fight like the word "nigger."

Nevertheless, there is one word that I've always understood to be highly insulting to a white person and that is the word "redneck." The word "redneck" implies in one breath that a person is stupid, uneducated, possibly toothless and dirty, and "poor white trash" (a truly horrible phrase). Yet, whites who are most likely to come from a family background that the uncivil would call "redneck" call each other "redneck" in jest. They apply a pejorative to themselves the same way some black people use the "n" word .

An entire industry has arisen with branding of the word "redneck." Think Jeff Foxworthy and Blue Collar Comedy.

If the UFO hotline limits you to one call per day you might be a redneck. If directions to your house include turn off the paved road, you might be a redneck. If you prefer to walk the excess length of your jeans instead of hem them, you might be a redneck. If going to the bathroom in the middle of the night involves shoes and flashlight, you might be a redneck. ... If your two-year-old has more teeth than you, you might be a redneck. ... If your mother has ever has come out of the bathroom and said 'Y'all come look at this before I flush it,' you might be a redneck. If your dad walks you to school because he's in the same grade with you, you might be a redneck." (Jeff Foxworthy)

Many people who say they're rednecks and proud of it howl with laughter at Foxworthy's routine. But where does the humor come from? I suspect it comes from a place of pain, the same way Richard Pryor's comedy, and he used the "n" word often, sometimes came from a place of pain. So, some poor whites have taken the word "redneck," embraced it, and taken away its sting, which is the defense Whoopi gave Elisabeth for using the "n" word (a defense not all blacks share).

Within the embrace-the-n-word defense is the rationale that whites may not use the "n" word because whites, while they may have their own experiences with pain, cannot experience the pain that comes from being black in America. Indeed, the argument goes, whites created the environment in which black pain fermented. And yes, Elisabeth Hasselbeck, white people also coined the "n" word and cultivated it in world culture long before black rappers went overboard with it and other black artists addressed the shame, pointing out that most consumers of rap music are white young men.

If anything, the history of the use of the "n" word points to whites mishandling language and black slaves, who could have been beaten for reading books, adopting their masters' bad habits. The word is a mispronunciation of the word "negro." Furthermore, when you consider how segregationists used even the word, "negro," you realize insult comes through intent with tone. You may have heard someone, for instance, refer to an African-American woman as that "black" girl, and you knew that the acknowlegment that the woman is black was in itself the insult in the person's mind.

Some Americans show that they believe the word black itself may be the insult when in an effort to be politically correct are afraid to describe an African-American as "black." Somewhere in their hearts these PC people sense that black, being the opposite of white and all things perceived as good in this society, may be the bad thing.

Mexicans experience this phenomena today as some people have associated distastefulness with the word "Mexican." When they say "Mexican" they could as easily be saying "wetback" because the tone of voice suggests disgust.

Likewise, I have heard people use the word "negro," which is not thought of as a pejorative, with a seething hatred for all things black. They say the word "negro" with the same venom another person says "nigger." And then there's simply a way of saying either word that no one can fathom:

My decision (to not use the "n" word in a book with slave narrations) also derived from my frustration in trying to puzzle out its use as recorded by the subjects’ amanuenses. It is often impossible to determine whether a former slave employed the word in its derogatory sense, or whether as a more neutral variation on the word “Negro.” In fact it is sometimes hard to judge whether they employed it at all, or whether it was introduced by their interviewers and their editors as part of their attempt to render all African-American testimony in “Negro Dialect.”

“The situation is always delicate,” wrote an Arkansas interviewer. “Somehow both interviewer and interviewee avoid the ugly word whenever possible. The skillful interviewer can generally manage to pass it by completely, as well as any variant of the word negro. The informant is usually less squeamish. ‘Black folks,’ ‘colored folks,’ ‘black people,’ ‘Master's people,’ ‘us’ are all encountered frequently.” (Andrew Ward)

Back to the word redneck. What if a white person of the so-called "upper" class who had never been poor, never in a position to be called "poor white trash" were to call another white person who did grow up poor and struggling a redneck. Would the person who had been called that name laugh with him/her sincerely? Unlikely. I'm talking ordinary people here, not spiritual gurus.

Of course, the word "redneck" could never be applied to a white person of second or third generation wealth who'd never done a day's hard labor. If you called a wealthy, educated white person a redneck, the person would probably give you a quizzical look, might even laugh. The epithet will never apply. He's not poor. He's not uneducated and toothless at 40, and neither is anyone in his immediate family.

But a black person, no matter how wealthy, no matter how educated, may be dehumanized in an instant by the "n" word as insult. He/She may put on bravado's mask, but the word "nigger" has a distinctive sting unlike any other. Can you assure him or her you did not mean it as insult?

And here I am, a black person. Would I call a blue collar white person in the south a "redneck" for fun? Let's say I just heard that same white person call his friend "redneck." Would that make it okay for me to do the same?

Answer: "Only if I'm an idiot." I know the history of the word. I know it's meant to denigrate. So, I really don't care what one white person calls another white person. That's between them. As a black person who knows it's a mean word, I sure as hell better not call him that name or any other racist insult unless I'm cruising for a brawl.

Where does that leave us and the Whoopi/Elisabeth show? At the same place this discussion should always take us if we practice civility, at The Golden Rule: treat other people the way you want to be treated. If you don't want people to be glib about throwing what may be an insult your way, then don't throw any their way.

Weepy, whiney Elizabeth Hasselbeck should know this as should any other mother or father who genuinely wants to raise children to live life as it should be lived. When you're teaching young children to contribute their best to this world, you don't need to give a history lesson about the "n" word. Neither do they need explanations for why the two black kids called each other that strange name. The only thing you or Elisabeth needs to teach a child as far as name calling goes is don't do it. Would she have us believe that if her child comes home and says I do drugs because other people do it that she would say, "Well, I can't teach you not to do that until those other children stop as well?"

When it's time for that history lesson about black people and white people in a country that in its past has condoned slavery, segregation, systemized brutality and oppression, then give that lesson. Until then, keep it simple.

So, bottom line for me, use of the "n" word when it comes to whites who want to use it has nothing to do with what black people feel free enough to call themselves within "the family." Ask yourselves, as Laina suggested in her post, "Why do you as a white person want to say the word at all?" The answer should scare you.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette (view blog) on Sat, 07/26/2008 - 20:33

Comments

 

Amen Sister!

 Nordette, that was awesome!

One thing that I want to riff on - something you mention is the actions pertaining to the "N" word and Negro versus the usage of the word. Something that I observed on Friday:

I was in a ritzy part of downtown Toronto on my lunch break with a co-worker. There was a young black man, well-dressed and attractive, sitting on a park bench close to the sidewalk with what looked like to be his two sons, both well-dressed and well behaved (about 2 and 5). As I was about to pass them, I noticed these two white women walking towards me (35-40) who were dripping with jewellry and obviously expensive clothing. One of the women bumped into the foot of one of the kids, and she looked over and nearly jumped out of her skin. She gave the kid the most hateful glare and the other woman, who grabbed her friend's hand ( in fear?) actually sneered at the family. I don't think the kids noticed, but the father certianly did.

I was shocked but I have witnessed this type of bullshit before. That, to me, is worse than someone calling them (or me) the "N" word. The hate on these women's faces was disgusting, especially towards two young children who were just being children. I realized in that moment, how much work needs to be done.

Great, informative post.

Cheers, Laina

Contributing Editor - Race, Ethnicity & Culture

Writing is Fighting: www.lainad.typepad.com

 

Submitted by lainad on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 03:11
 

Much deeper than name calling

I can imagine that scene, Laina. In fact, I've witnessed similar, which is why I brought up the word "negro" and how some people use even the word "black."

To have someone look with disgust at a child because of race and the fears they associate with the race shows, as you say, how much work we still need to do. Eliminating a "word" is not what's needed. Elevating consciousness so that people remove the desire to denigrate others from than hearts is what we need and a way to come to terms with ourselves so we stop letting primal fears and political fears run our lives.

By the way, I purposely also used the word "denigrate" in the post, which in its purest form means "to make black." In essence, to be belittle=to make black. We could be here all day disucussing negative associations with darkness and blackness that have been transferred to people with dark skin.  

Thank you for writing your post that led to this one and for opening this discussion again.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 09:29
 

Well I was going to use Amen too in this
subject line!

But then I scrolled down and saw Laina's subject title. ;)

I agree, I totally agree.  And I do not understand why it's so hard for people to accept that there are meta-languages we have within our groups - whatever that group might be.

The misuse of the word "yente" lacks the hatred conveyed by the n word when spoken by non-POC, but it's use by non-Jews to slur Jews does occur (I'm saying that I'd be an idiot to suggest that its misuse is as repulsive as the misuse or justification for the use of the n word by non-POC - it is not).

But I think I wrote about how someone who isn't Jewish and isn't on the same side of the aisle as me politically and isn't a woman and isn't a mother and probably doesn't have all the girlfriends I have called me a "yente" in a very inappropriate and, to me, clearly condescending way.

Now - I might call or refer to a friend as a yente, in the presence of other Jewish friends, and it would be understood that I'm just saying, "oy, she talked my ear off about nonsense" as well as, yes, an insult.  And I feel badly just writing that! Maybe I shouldn't be using the word - but no one in my "group" would necessarily chastise me per se for using the word because it's a pretty commonly used word in that context. They'd only say perhaps that I'm wrong or I shouldn't be mean etc.

But the way this blogger used it on his political blog completely has no similar context.  It was used as a slur.  I left a comment to how I viewed it and he apologize and removed it.  End of story.  I actually didn't expect that outcome and it really impressed me in a positive way.

So I go back to that question - why do people refuse to accept this fact re: the use of meta-language within groups?

Because as you wrote in a FANTASTIC closing line: 

Ask yourselves, as Laina suggested in her post, "Why do you as a white person want to say the word at all?"  The answer should scare you.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks

Submitted by Jill Miller Zimon on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 05:17
 

The word "yente"

Jill, great response. I also saw your response on Laina's post about the term "JAP" for Jewish American Princess. Both are applicable to this discussion when it comes to meta languages.

Trying to remove the "racial" side for a moment, I've also made a similar analogy in the past with how my mother's generation used the word "heifer" to refer to not only friends in the presence of those friends but also to use it for women they didn't like. Anyone listening knew whether the name was an insult or a friendly poke. But as you say, none of these words carries the force of the "n" word. I have, however, also heard women use the word "b*tch" with dual meaning, and that's a word we're hearing more too.

We hear dual uses of some words over and over, and yet folks keep pretending it's unusual to use language like this and it's something only black people do. Folks grab any excuse to make their bad behavior seem acceptable. "He or she did it too" is one of the oldest excuses in the book. :-)

Yeah, all the way to Adam's story.  He told God he ate the apple because Eve did and gave it to him, and oh, btw, God, it's your fault too because she is "the woman you gave me."  We have trouble taking responsibility for what we choose to do sometimes, especially what we choose to say.  The free will to control ourselves is a bucking horse;  we'd rather let it throw us than use a bridle.

Thanks for your wisdom. And if we're going to make an issue about word use, then it's time to ask ourselves about the "c" word again and why a presidential candidate used that freely to refer to his wife. Why we say what we say is worthy of reflection.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 09:59
 

And of course Cheney

And the "f" word.  Great point re: taking responsibility for the evolution (or deterioration?!) of language and understanding.  Even though I can intellectual say and point to reasons why we haven't gotten any further on certain fronts and issues, it still totally stuns me.  It just shouldn't or have to be this way - at least, that's how I feel, even as I try to confront it in myself and my own enabling behaviors.

Jill
Writes Like She Talks

Submitted by Jill Miller Zimon on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 10:02
 

Healing the pain

When I was a child in Miami, I was walking down the sidewalk with my mother in a white commercial area.  I saw a white man kick a small black boy, about 4, out of his way.  Not real hard, but certainly shocking.  Racism in the 60's was really frightening and shocking.  Eventually riots and firebombing followed.  In many way the bridges to healing were closed by black rage as they had been by white evil. It's understandable. 

 

Even though I am white, I am concerned that equality hasn't been reached in this nation.   It doesn't make me black, it doesn't change my experiences.  But I don't feel I have a voice in your world, you have already described mine.  That doesn't change my view, I will still acknowledge the issues for black Americans are grave.  

 

I saw a lot of black people in the fields picking cotton and living in houses without water or electricity as a small child.  When I was a young woman they were replaced by migrant workers, all men, who showed up for a few weeks and dissapeared.  (A lot of people think I'm talking about migrant Mexican workers, but they were black).  Now I think they are small children in foreign countries and non-citizens in this country making substandard wages.  The oppression becomes more and more shielded... the greater the distance the less people care about the enormity of the problem.   There are people in the US who live on the desert and carry water by hand from a nearby town to drink and bath in, they don't speak English.  Is there anyway to help them without displacing aid to black Americans? (I'd like to mention the rich white girls are just more white people who aren't giving up any control and I'm really glad to see Obama trump Hillary.)

 

As much as I believe in your cause, I am focused on not engaging you on the issues of "Rednecks" in the south or whether white people who can barely read or write, deserve to thrive.   I would rather believe that our own healing comes from healing others.  The further we move from our own problems, they less people can unite us with a bigoted group identiy.  I don't know if I'm right, it's just what I believe.

 

Obama will be the next president of this country.  He may be the voice of black America or he may be the voice of the world.  It will depend on how people rally around him and whether he wins that voice.  It could be a turn around not only for Americans, but for Africans and dark skinned people in Australia.   It could also change lives for all people who labor with their hands and are often removed from their families to serve an elite class they will never meet.  You are a wonderful writer and I hope you continue blogging. 

Submitted by PhazingOut on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 05:24
 

Phazing Out

Phazaing Out, thank you for your commentary, to which I responded below. I thought I clicked a reply to you, but instead it went here:

http://www.blogher.com/season-our-discontent-or-life-n-word#comment-51372

Glad you took the time to comment.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 10:24
 

Absolutely!

Your post is very insightful, and the analogy to using the word "redneck" is a good one. 

Submitted by Asianmommy on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 06:26
 

:-) AM

Thank you, AM.  I'm glad you enjoyed this post and got the analogy

I dropped by on your KungFu Panda post, and also wanted you to know that your Boston Kids Spots post is a good guide for parents in Boston.  It's the kind of guide I would have published when I ran a localized parenting magazine years ago. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 10:36
 

Excellent Post!!

I don't even know what else to say besides that. You said it all for me. 

 

- Maria

http://immoralmatriarch.com

Submitted by Maria0305 on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 08:01
 

Wicked, Maria

Thanks, Maria. Dropped by Immoral Matriarch. Ha! You've got a wicked sense of humor. LOL. :-) I've actually been by before but didn't have time to drop you a line. The name of the blog alone is hoot.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 10:41
 

Obama the voice of black America?

This comment was written in response to PhazingOut's comment near the top. 

I thank you for your thoughtful response, Phazing Out. However, I did wonder about this section:

As much as I believe in your cause, I am focused on not engaging you on
the issues of "Rednecks" in the south or whether white people who can
barely read or write, deserve to thrive.

I said nothing in this post that implies poor or uneducated whites don't have a right to thrive. There's nothing here that suggest I believe any group should suffer injustice. I really don't understand what you mean with that part of your comment and feel you bring your own assumptions to the discussion about so-called "black rage" that are not in the spirit of this post.

Also, I appreciate your willingness to believe that Obama can be a world leader; however, I think he's already surpassed being a so-called "black leader." His appeal clearly crosses ethnic groups and by his own words he wants to speak for all Americans, not just the ethnic group with which he identifies.

Thank you again for sharing your views, especially your calling attention to the dire poverty some people in this nation face. Some theorists believe racism and poverty, when it comes to black people, are correlated. However, if we strive to unite, then whatever solutions that help one group on the bottom socioeconically should help all groups on the bottom. For instance, Civil Rights legislation designed initially to help African-Americans ultimately helped all people struggling for equality. Fair housing laws, written to stop discrimination against blacks, helped other groups that faced housing discrimination. And any poverty program instituted by the government that may have been initiated with African-Americans in mind inevitably also helped poor white Americans. We'd like to think we're in different boats when it comes to poverty and injustice, but we're on the same ship, sink or float.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 10:27
 

Our hope for progress

Hi Nordette,

I suspect we are from different generations, maybe from different parts of the country. If I am out of sync with your point perhaps you could attribute that to differences in our experiences. I lived in a white trailor park in the middle of Liberty City (the police pulled me over for driving home with my windows down in the middle of the summer). We were not the target the business community was. Yes, that's rage. When people rise up and publically rebel in mass.. it's rage. I don't want to validate my point or argue. I do want you to understand that's what I refer to as rage. It wasn't about people who were angry over an isolated incident. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_City_Riots

The word "redneck" implies in one breath that a person is stupid,
uneducated, possibly toothless and dirty, and "poor white trash" (a
truly horrible phrase). Yet, whites who are most likely to come from a family background that the uncivil would call "redneck" call each other "redneck" in jest.

Gee, I don't think you have a lot of experience being called a redneck, or would know if the term has been defused by white humor. I think it would be counter-productive for me to whine about my unique personal experiences, because as you said poverty is comlex. Programs that help the poor, help whites too.

 

I took exception to people using the "N" as a young woman because the harm was so obvious. People who were once cast in a submissive role could not rise because they shared an oppressed group identity. But the damage goes far deeper than that. I took an African dance class recently because a young woman invited me (in New York). When I tried to follow her lead, I felt it undermined her cofidence.. as though I was judging her. My son's friend is one of those black kids who got the Merry Christmas choral at Tuffs, and he wanted to know if I felt it was unfair that he had gone to such a great school when my son was given remedial education. We love him very much and of coarse I told him I was proud of his accomplishments. I have also at other times told him we we just people someone set in the woods and when they came back a hundred years later, we hadn't died.

 

What I fear is that as an uppper class black presence is created in American society, that poor blacks will suffer more. The constant hopelessness and assault on pride will bring friction and some simple slang will distinguish the victims as uncivil and undeserving people who are somehow genetically different the others. It has been my experience that mass opinion feels a few winners recitifies the woes of many.

 

If you are lax on words that you use privately among friends, it doesn't dignify the pubic use of the word. It means different things coming from different people at different times. When we can't acknowledge the damage, we discredit the rage that some will certainly feel. Or as I was told as a child, "Don't talk to those people, don't get them stirred up." The rage becomes volcano and seperates us all; not the frustration of a lost opportunity to teach. I believe that more often, it is most important that people are not invisible in their suffering.

 

There is no doubt that black America has rallied to Obama, but I am glad about that.  I don't really see him as being black, his mother is white his childhood seemed pretty white to me.   But most of black America isn't particularly black and as long as the divisions of race cause harm in this country Obama will be black.  He will also be a world leader.  Just like Clinton doesn't ever completely loose his accent, Obama is a strong statement for the values of black culture and leadership.   If that happens to reflect on white Americans, perhaps we will all will share that pride.   

Submitted by PhazingOut on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 13:10
 

One more time here

First, thank you.  I'm glad you like Obama and want us all to live in peace and to overcome inequalities.  I'm glad we agree on some important matters.  Neverthess, I still get the impression you think I said something that I did not say. 

Did I say something that indicates it's okay to call people redneck?  Did I say anything that suggests it's okay to call people the "n" word?  Did I say that people no longer feel pain when being called "redneck" and that it's a universally acceptable word to use with people?  No, I did not.  In fact I said I don't use the word for the same reasons I hope no one uses the word "ni**er." I think it's clear I find racial slurs odious.

I realize it's a long post and a reader might overlook part of it, but I'm pretty sure I did not say anything that suggests I condone using such words or that people don't still feel pain over the use of slurs, even slurs that comedians use routinely in comedy routines.  In fact, I'm pretty sure I said that even the humor around these words is based on experiences with pain. 

Many people who say they're rednecks and proud of it howl with
laughter at Foxworthy's routine.  But where does the humor come from? 
I suspect it comes from a place of pain, the same way Richard Pryor's comedy, and he used the "n" word often, sometimes came from a place of pain.

And if you follow that quote futher, you'll find that I used the qualifier "some" before "white people" so as not to suggest that every single white person on the planet has embraced the word "redneck."   I'm sure there are white people who feel about the word "redneck" the way many blacks feel about the word "n*gg*r," which would be that it should not be used either in public or in private unless it's a discussion such as this one.

What I did do in my post was state how people have used both words.  And I stand behind calling people who use these word "uncivil."  If we can't learn to at least be civil to one another we're in trouble.  However, I know that the problem goes much deeper than civility.

Also, I do not think that being uncivil could legitimately be classified as a genetic disorder and anyone who posits such nonsense I would assume to be an atrocious, eugenics proponent who falls into the same class with Hitler.  As a black woman, I am loathe to ever embrace any ideas that any type of behavior that may be classified as ethical or unethical is genetic.  We'd be the first ones to whom the eugenics brigade would point a finger.

Gee, I don't think you have a lot of experience being called a redneck,
or would know if the term has been defused by white humor. I think it
would be counter-productive for me to whine about my unique personal
experiences, because as you said poverty is comlex. Programs that help
the poor, help whites too.

Pretty obvious that I would not be called a redneck.  I don't know that that word is ever applied to a black person 

I simply stated that there's an industry that's grown around the word "redneck" and that some white people say they're proud to be rednecks the way some black people claim the "n" word doesn't bug them.  That's a statement of fact and not my personal opinion.

I wouldn't have experience being called a redneck as I'm not white neither was I raised in dire poverty.  However, it is true that if I dressed in my best attire and a white person who thought of him/herself as a so-called "redneck" dressed in exactly the same attire in appearance, that I'd be subjected to forms of prejudice in mainstream parts of society that the white person would not be. I may be subjected to negative opinions about my skills at work, for instance, simply because of my skin color.  I can escape poverty and the signs of poverty as can anyone in America with the right tools, but I can't escape racism.  My skin identifies my origin.   The only good thing I can say on this subject is that some people are not as racist as others and laws have changed to make blatant discrimination illegal.

It has been my experience that mass opinion feels a few winners recitifies the woes of many.

That has been my experience as well.  It won't be long before some parts of the population are declaring that we have no problems with race or poverty because Obama made it.  Some folks already point at Oprah this way. 

I too would not like to quibble about class and how people are treated differently based on social class in this discussion because this discussion is about using the "N" word and how other groups also use words in a less threatening way, words that have been used to disparage them.  I really don't want to go another area on this right now because I don't think anything good comes from bluster about whose pain is greater when it comes to poor whites vs. blacks, of whom some are quite wealthy.  If we do that then we become dupes to divide and conquer methodologies.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 14:03
 

Amazing, Nordette

That was an amazing post. I don't have much to add in this comment (for once!). As I alluded to in Laina's piece a few days ago, I strongly believe there is much work left for white people to engage in regarding power/privilege/opression/unintentional (and intentional) consequences in this society. I hope posts like yours and Laina's  inspire more than just a few of us to have this discussion.

Thanks again.

-Lara

 

Notions of Identity

Submitted by Laracolvin on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 11:09
 

Lara, thank you.

I adapted "I'm frustrated" from your comment on Laina's post.  So, thank you. :-) 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 14:05
 

Thank you for this post. 

Thank you for this post.  What people need to realize is that there simply is no equivalent to the n-word.  I hesitated to watch the View video because the ignorance and shelteredness (is that a word?) of folks like Ms Hasselbeck just makes my blood boil.

I grew up in predominantly black neighborhoods in Philadelphia, was one of two white families on my block up until age nine and the only white kid in a class of 32 when I was in public school.

The context of the use of the n-word never confused me – for instance, when classmates used it I knew they were granted some unspoken permission but that for me it represented hate, bigotry and ugliness and it was never okay.

This topic is so interesting and I think many whites (like EH) just don’t understand or relate to the notion of “other” or living with any knowledge of what marginalization really means.  I’m often asked “what was it like being the only white kid?”  And my response…I didn’t know any different!  But I can say I learned a lot about issues of race and otherness at a very young age.

When my best friend (we’ll call her Tanya) and I were eight, our mothers sent us off to sleep over camp for two weeks.  It was our first time away from home and we shared a bunk together among four or five girls.  This was the first time I remember being truly cognizant of our racial differences.  I was no longer the only white kid since the camp was predominantly white.  But this wasn’t the case for Tanya.  A few days into our stay, we sat commiserating over our shared homesickness.  Tanya was particularly saddened and said to me, “I miss my people.”  Attempting to cheer her up I added, “But Tanya, I’m your people!”  And she then replied, “No – I miss my people.” For the first time, I really got it.  My immediate feeling (from my eight year old self) was that she’d punched me in the gut – I felt a great sense of rejection and not being enough for her…even though I was like family, I still was not her people.

Part of the reason that EH from the View got all teary (I can only guess) is that she can’t accept this notion – that our experiences of race/racism/differences/otherness can’t be made to go away when we want them too and that language (slang/pejorative/colloquial/racist and otherwise) is complicated.  I was lucky in a sense that I grew up in a setting where there was an open dialogue about race and there was no hiding from real discussion.  Careful PC talk and the veil of academic jargon can often cripple us from really talking about race – I’ve been following lots of these threads and I really value this forum!

Submitted by MiriamAnton on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 11:35
 

blessed, Miriam

You've had a unique blessing, Miriam, to experience what it's like to be one of few and then to see inside a culture that had you lived elsewhere may not have seen. I don't think some people understand that the ability and opportunity to know and empathize with people unlike yourself is a gift that if handled properly only makes you richer.

I'm recalling now how the late Randy Pausch quoted the saying that it's not the cards we're dealt but how we play our hand.  When we take life, learn, and grow, we make life better not only for ourselves but also for the world around us.

Some people spend time around other cultures and come away with their negative opinions strengthened.  We get what we give and see what we prefer to see. 

I appreciate your sharing your experiences in this discussion.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 13:02
 

food for thought

I'm new to BlogHer ... and it's funny that I'd stumble across this topic because I just wrote about it on my own blog. ( http://ldpundit.blogspot.com/2008/07/who-is-nigger.html )

I didn't see the Whoopi-Elisabeth dust-up about the "N" word, but I feel that one should avoid using it at all costs.  (I'm not a fan of the show ... but I digress.)  Don't get me wrong: I'm not calling for censorship ... but why justify using it as a "term of endearment" when another six-letter word -- friend -- is just as suitable.  I'm a Black woman, and I'd never refer to myself that way because there's so much more to me than my skin color.  It's bad enough that racism still exists in 2008; I have no interest in perpetuating stereotypes about my ethnicity by allowing someone to call me out of my name.

A similar argument can be made for the "B" word.  Some women don't mind being addressed as such ... but I never caught a frisbee with my mouth, fetched a newspaper, or rolled over and played dead for another person's amusement.  The View panelists involved in this dispute are old enough to know that education is the best tool to combat ignorance.  Then again, maybe I'm just being naive.

Submitted by theauthoress on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:26
 

No

No disagreement here.  Thanks for commenting. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:28
 

Thanks

Great post with a lot of really good points. It makes me sad that we still want to dehumanize each other in any way.

Submitted by suebob on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:33
 

The human condition

Thanks, Sue.  You're not alone in feeling this sadness, but let's hope that as we continue these types of discussions, we grow and overcome this negative quality in our human condition. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:52
 

A Very Important Post

Hi Nordette,

I'd like to add my thanks to everyone else's for such a powerful post.  Like Laina did in her post, you were able to broaden the discussion from "The View" to a larger discussion that relates to the rest of us.

As you know, I'm of the opinion that neither blacks or white should be calling me n*gger.  And though I agree with you about the use of the word "redneck" and "bitch" and "heifer," I don't care what other groups want to call themselves.  Because I'm black, I'm more concerned with what black people call themselves, how they treat each other, and how we move ourselves forward. 

When it comes to white people like Elisabeth Hasselbeck and their puzzlement over this discussion and seeing it from the outside, you're absolutely right when you say:

Part of the problem may be that some white people deny how much power they've enjoyed in this world, do not wish to consciously grasp the value of having white skin in a society that has historically favored white skin.

So, they tell themselves that if there are any benefits to being white, they personally have not experienced it and so, therefore, have not benefited no matter what Andrew Hacker and those hoity-toity academics think. 

But whites can get away with calling themselves whatever derogatory terms they want because they are still white.  And like I said in my own post on this issue, I think the use by performers of inflammatory language, has a lot to do with them being performers.  They are trying to make a name for themselves and part of that involves being different and/or outrageous.  Whoopi Goldberg and Jeff Foxworthy don't live in the same world as the rest of us. 

As an example, I can't listen to most uncensored standup comedy routines by black performers because their use of the word n*gger insults, hurts and saddens me. 

My ancestors didn't fight and die to allow performers or anyone else to call me n*gger. 

Do I understand the argument some blacks make for using the word?  Yes, I just don't agree with them.  Do I think that means it will stop tomorrow?  No, although I wish it would.  Do I think that race hatred will continue whether the word is used or not?  Unfortunately, yes.

But talking and writing about it is still better than not talking or writing about it, and shining a light on our motives and feelings, whether we're black or white, can only be a good thing.

Megan Smith
BlogHer Contributing Editor, TV/YouTube
Megan's Minute: Quirky Commentary Around The Clock

Submitted by Megan Smith on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:34
 

Yes, I linked to your post.

Yes, Megan, I know how you feel. I linked to you in this post in the parentheses regarding people who disagree with Whoopi's defense. Thank you for that. People often think confuse understanding an argument and seeing the other person's point means that you practice what they practice. No, it simply means you understand what they're saying.

Also, the final point of my post is the same you make here. It shouldn't concern us what people call each other within their own groups, and that would include groups of black people when we're black as well but have been raised differently and taught to follow a more civil standard and to be polite as well as to treat people with dignity. We're accountable for what we do and that's why the best way is to treat people as you want to be treated and teach your children to do the same.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 12:49
 

Nothing more to add

other than to the chorus of kudos to you (and Laina, Megan and all those who have commented on this and other posts) for a thoughtful, nuanced, necessary and important discussion.

ConsumerPop Marketing
PopConsumer (Politics, Current Events & Links)
Beyond Help (Music, TV & Pop Culture)

Submitted by Maria Niles on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 15:11
 

What!

What do you mean, Maria, that you have nothing to add?!! LOL.  I was looking forward to what you had to say after reading your post Is Black the New Bitch?  :-)  I'm kind of sorry you're out of words, but I know you've written quite a bit on these types of issues already.

Thank you for your wisdom. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 16:05
 

Excellent post

Thank you so much for this excellent post. I think a lot of well-meaning white Americans' struggle with trying to find the "right" words--I'm thinking here of your example of someone who was afraid to use the word "black"--is that the language of race is slippery. Appropriate terms come and go--Negro, Afro-American, African-American--or linger a bit and then fade.

But there's one term that hangs around, despite its never having been appropriate for white people to use: N.

I appreciate your comparison of N to "redneck," but I'm having a hard time seeing the similarity in terms of intent. N is a far, far stronger word, one with a much more sinister history. "Redneck" refers, yes, pretty much solely to white people, but it also implies a class standing that--as tough as it might be--a "redneck" could aspire to overcome through education or increased income.

The same is not true of N. One cannot hope (and should not have to hope) to change one's race or ethnicity.

I would have no problem with you using the term "redneck" among an all-black or mixed-race group of friends on a Saturday night. I would have a huge problem if a white person used the N-word in front of me, regardless of who else was in the room. "Redneck" brushes aside people of a certain race and class as being hopelessly out of touch with the mainstream, which is sad. N does far worse--it dehumanizes people.

As you yourself point out, "redneck" has become a subculture within comedy. White comics--who might never have been called "redneck" themselves but who are willing to play rednecks on TV--are "reclaiming" the term as one of affection for wayward cousins. But by playing rednecks on TV, these comics also are marking themselves as not redneck. They know what a redneck is, and while they pretend to embrace their, er, neckedness, they actually are setting themselves apart from "real" rednecks by drawing borders around what makes someone a redneck, by defining what that person looks like and how he acts. And rule #1: A real redneck is not savvy enough to land a contract for a comedy series on national television.

There is one word that I don't think anyone has raised thus far in this conversation (at least in this post and its comments): queer. Queer was a term of denigration, but it was reclaimed by queer people as a mark of pride.

In similar ways, as I believe Whoopi Goldberg pointed out (but it may have been Sherri Shepherd--I can't remember who brought it up because it's been several days since I watched the video), N has been reclaimed by African Americans--but in a very different way. It's not a public reclaiming, except maybe in some rap music and comedy like Richard Pryor's. It will never--thank God--become a politically correct term like "queer" has become. It's such a loaded term that we're not even spelling it out in this space.

I can't tie this comment up neatly, but I just wanted to reflect a bit on redneck vs. queer vs. N, and how these words, all of which denigrate to different degrees, have taken very different paths to acceptance in different communities.

Thanks again for a great post, Nordette.

Leslie

BlogHer Contributing Editor, Research and Academia
Proprietor, The Clutter Museum
I also blog at Museum Blogging and The Multicultural Toybox.

Submitted by Leslie Madsen Brooks on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 15:13
 

Queer the word, queer the insult, and other
thoughts

Actually, Leslie, I almost brought that word up, but then realized with all the ideas popping in my head I'd take up the entire site writing. :-) I thought of that show Queer Eye for the Straight Guy and a few other examples. Yet the word "queer," because of the phonetic liquids is less threatening than some other words. Yet, I'm sure anyone part of the glbt community who's had the word "queer" spat at them to insult them would say liquids or not, that hurts!'

I also thought about how non-gay teens will call each other "gay" as though to be gay is both an insult and joke. I don't know if teens who are actually gay, however, do this at all.

I agree, "N" is dramatically more powerful a word than "redneck," evoking a visceral response from some people of all ethnic groups who'd prefer it not be used. And that was part of my point, there is no racial slur that folks toss at white people that can make them as angry and hurt as much as the "n" word when tossed at black folk.

However, I described some of the other implications of being called redneck that not all people realize may be assoicated with it. I grew up in the south, and while some folks here claim they're glad to be "rednecks," others associate being called redneck with being something far worse than what the comedians poke fun at. If you call somebody a "redneck" who grew up without indoor plumbing and never went past the sixth grade and who feels the pain of that lifestyle still, then you might find you join him/her in having fewer teeth because somebody's gonna pop you in the mouth.

All this may be a generational thing here. I'm 48 and have observed concepts associated with the word "redneck" change. The popularity of Foxworthy's "You might be a redneck if" took me by surprise.

I do believe the phrase "poor white trash" as I mentioned, is horrible and that is a slur that redneck often includes. I can imagine what a child might feel like being raise to think of him or herself that way, as trash.

I chose the word "redneck" not because I feel it's equivalent to the "n" word but because most people recognize "redneck" as a pejorative but have also seen it used in comedy the way the "n" word's been used by black comedians. Chris Rock has a routine, btw, in which he separates the "n****rs" from the black people called "I Hate N*gg*rs." I'm sure you'd squirm in your seat listening to it. Much more harsh than "You Might Be A Redneck If ..."

In effect, Rock is making an observation but also trying to brand the word as a  description reserved for a certain behavior while also getting us to see how weird we are about the word as black people and snobby toward each other.  Nobody wants to think he's talking about them, not really. But oh, they know somebody else who fits it just right.  He has similar commentary in a routine about women dancing to rap music when the men are talking about "hos" and women as objects.  If you question them about why they dance to that music, he said, they respond, "He's not talking about me."

I cringe on Chris Rock's stuff becaue of the high level of profanity period. Nevertheless, he is smart.

Again, I'm not saying redneck and the "n" word are the same, but pointing out similarities. If the words evoked the same level of bitterness and pain none of us would spell out "redneck."  We'd be calling it the "R" word. 

However, while it would not bother you if I tossed the word "redneck" around in jest, I simply wouldn't do it because someone may be offended and I know the word's history or how it's really been hurtful to some people on the receiving end.

The fact that there is no racial slur for white people with as much hatred associated with it as the word "n****r" is a statement in and of itself.

Thank you, Leslie, I'm glad you got something out of the post. BTW, on those hoity-toity academics, I linked to your post on this idea that liberal professors are brainwashing our youth.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 16:19
 

Oh, you might be ghetto if

Wanted to add, Leslie, that "you might be ghetto if ..." would be more an equivalent to "you might be a redneck if ..." But I'm sure there are people who are also offended by "ghetto" because to they don't feel poverty and isolation can ever be the punch line even if the intent is supposedly to remove the sting.

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 16:44
 

Wow...just WOW!

Nordette, that was such a fantastic post. I was particularly struck by your italicized paragraph regarding the dehumanizing effect of the "n" word on a black person, no matter how wealthy or successful that person may be. You articulated perfectly why such an insult is so repellent (or should be) to people of all races.

 

Julie

mothergoosemouse

Submitted by mothergoosemouse on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 20:34
 

Thank you, Julie

It's always good to hear that someone picked up the details of what we've said and understood it.

BTW, I dropped by MotherGooseMouse.  I really enjoyed your don't drink, don't smoke post, and I also like the graphic you use for your banner. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Tue, 07/29/2008 - 16:21
 

Perhaps that's why I love Toni Morrison

I've been poor white trash in the trailer park, as well as one of the few white kids living in "the hood."  As a result, I've always been extremely sensitive about class and race, and the idea that someone like Hasselback presumes to have anything to say about this other than just noting that it's a loaded term and she doesn't want her children to ever say it, is laughable.  But then again, she is often laughable--earnest maybe, but laughable.  Morrison's idea of subverting the master narrative always appealed to me so much.   That's what intriques me so much about the white kids using the N word.  What are they doing?  Postmodernism definitely cannot explain it.  Your post was beyond excellent--extremely focused and well written.  You made me think about putting more energy back into crafting my posts.

Your conclusion and Laina's are right on...We all need to more critical about the words that we use and why.  I have my own reasons to feel ambivalent in this area that I won't get into, but I've been thinking about this a lot.  Thanks!

The strangest thing about all of this is that when I got to the part of your post where you wrote "don't do it," I immediately starting hearing Grandmaster Flash singing "White Lines" in my head.   Da da da da da da don't do it!

 

Yours, Tracy Viselli (a.k.a. Myrna the Minx)

My Company

Reno Fabulous Media: www.renofabulousmedia.com
My Main Blog
Reno and Its Discontents: www.renodiscontent.com

Submitted by myrnatheminx on Sun, 07/27/2008 - 21:16
 

We're dating ourselves

You said Grandmaster Flash and I knew who you were talking about. Haha! We're dating ourselves. :-)

Thanks for your thoughtful comments. 

Nordette is a Contributing Editor with BlogHer.com whose personal blog is hosted on another site at this link.

Submitted by Nordette on Mon, 07/28/2008 - 18:14
 

The Carbon Footprint of an Insult

While I don't disagree with MOST of what you said, at all, this still gets down to a question of "is this really the world that I want to create?"  It's a question both of the larger world in which we all live, but also the very small world in which my movements create the way others treat me on a daily basis.

I cannot imagine ANYONE ever using the N word.  We are all taught that the golden rule is to treat others as we want them to treat ourselves. What we are not taught is that how we treat ourselves is how we teach others to treat us. Any time that someone calls themselves a "denigrating" name they are saying that they are a) worthy of denigration and b) accept being treated in that manner. It may not be the intent, but I believe it is the impact. 

I have heard it said that we "reclaim" words by using them on ourselves, but that makes no sense to me. A violent act is a violent act whether it is a punch or a racial slur. As a rape survivor, I would certainly never try to "reclaim" that violence that was done to me by doing it to myself and others.

Were I to go around doing that, I would simply be adding more violence in to the world. Which gets me to the carbon footprint of an insult. (A concept that someone brought up in the Positive Posting Panel that I spoke on at BlogHer 08.)  Regardless of the justifications we may come up with to continue hurling insults at ourselves an others, it doesn't change the fact that we are still hurling insults into the world around us. Like a frog put in tap water who has the heat slowly turned up around them, I think that we are all boiled  and steeping in an environment in which rather than CHANGING the nature of the thing we protest, we have accepted and become it. I find that very sad and frightening.

I don't think there is ever an excuse to insult another person in that way. But even less to insult ourselves that way. While I LOVE your choice of the word denigrate (LOVE it), I think that the more accurate word is DEGRADE and DEGRADING. But, as we all know, when we degrade any strand in the fabric of our community, we weaken the fabric as a whole. 

I treat others how I want to be treated. I treat myself how I want others to treat me. And, like it or not, I look at how others treat themselves to learn how I can and should - or IF I SHOULD - interact with them. As long as that treatment of self involves being degrading to themselves and people around them, I'm not sure how deep I can let my interactions go, as our value structure seems askew.

Indeed, it's a horrible quagmire when the use of a word comes to define and entire segment of the population. But using it doesn't make it go away. And certainly saying that "we can" and "you can't" does more to divide us than unite us.

I have taught my daughter not to say it, and no, I didn't give her a whole lot of reasons. Just up there with "you cant' kill kittens."

There is a quick nod into self-deprecating humor that perhaps we ought to make. I call myself a space case all the time, and I do it as a warning that it will take me longer to get something done than it should. I use it as a warning. We all do that, I think. "I'm on the rag" is code for "I'm either going to cry or slap you." So what is the warning, the hidden code, when I say, "I'm just a redneck." Or, I'll say it, "I'm just a nigger." Or even, "I'm a nigger and I'm proud."  We cannot, in fact, change the meaning of this word, it's etched in generations of breath.  We just keep putting it out there, making it okay and telling others that this is the pot in which we want to live.

I just don't want to. I won't add to that. And I'll remain sad anytime someone does. Because I shouldn't have to tell my daughter that even though everyone else is degrading our world, she can't. When will we all be able to learn by example?

But then again, I'm an original Redneck. I'm a Hatfield baby, they make cartoons about my family tree. And I'm proud of it, but not in a "reclaim the word" way. I'm proud of where my people have been and have come and reminded that we all contain multitudes and no one's heritage defines them, whether we want it to or not.  But how we behave in the world does. 

____________

Alyssa Royse

Just Cause It: A Web Site To Save The World

Start Her Up: A Blog for Women Entrepreneurs

Submitted by alyssaroyse on Mon, 07/28/2008 - 07:25
 

Round and around we go

Alyssa, you make some excellent points, but I'm not sure why you framed what you said in the context of disagreeing with me on people using the "n" word. Nothing in my post says that I agree with Whoopi or anyone else who has reasons for using the "n" word. Neither did I say I use the word or that my children use the word.

Understanding why people do what they do is not the same as condoning it.

Indeed, it's a horrible quagmire when the use of a word comes to define and entire segment of the population. But using it doesn't make it go away. And certainly saying that "we can" and "you can't" does more to divide us than unite us.

Again, to whom are you speaking? I don't advocate its use or adhere to the reclaim it doctrine. Do you have those double standard issues I keep reading about, white people upset because they think black people are getting ahead of them? Are you reasoning that this is some kind of reverse discrimination that black people use a word that white people created to insult black people but object when white people use the insult, as usual, against black people?

You know, if white people don't want to own up to the word, and black people are willing to possess it, then maybe we can say "don't use our word" because we've claimed it and you can't have it back! (Just kidding, but that bit does show how ridiculous it is to argue about who can use the word when we know that no one should use it.)

Do white people lose something if they can't say the word "nigger"? Are you suffering assautls to your civil rights because you're itching to use this word but we black people control the world and don't approve?

Rules only divide when they're not fair and it's clear that the party being prevented from doing a certain thing is harmed by not being allowed to do that thing. Any other arguments about fairness is an endulgence in whiney infantilism. (also, people tend to object more when a rule prevents them from doing
something they actually want to do.) We're not talking about the right to own property, to get a job, to use a water fountain. We're talking about white people actually fighting for the "right" to insult black people the same way they always have and to say they do so because black people have low self-esteem and insult themselves sometimes. Is that a cause you'll stand up for?

So what is the warning, the hidden code, when I say, "I'm just a redneck." Or, I'll say it, "I'm just a nigger." Or even, "I'm a nigger
and I'm proud." We cannot, in fact, change the meaning of this word,
it's etched in generations of breath. We just keep putting it out
there, making it okay and telling others that this is the pot in which
we want to live.

So, it's out there. Does that mean you should use it? If white people just decided to stop using it, it would be out there less. Why do they object, go in a circle, and say y'all stop it first?

As I said in my post, these kinds of declarations and reclaiming, using the weapon that was once used against you as a symbol of power, which is why some Christians, for instance, wear crosses, are born from pain and a belief that you've overcome the pain or threat. I don't spend time trying to get people to justify to me how they choose to address their own pain. (Again, understanding does not say it's okay.)

I do, however, not use their pain and how they work through it as an excuse to treat them as badly as they treat themselves. It's not right to use the word and so I don't use it, but my post was not about what I do. My post addresses excuses white people give as well as this pretense some adopt that only black people use self-deprecating language.

Okay, so you get that black people are not the only group that does that. My illuminating that other people also use words for themselves that were created to demean them was not a defense for using the "n" word. It was another way to show that some white people pretend that black people's behavior is unusual in this regard when it is, in fact, not. And if it's not unusual, then it's probably something white people let go or ignore with other groups yet hold against black people. I'm tired of that type of singling out black folks.

I also believe words have power and we should avoid branding ourselves with negatives, but I don't see how someone can let themsleves off the hook to insult others with the excuse the person doesn't have self-respect and calls him/herself names. What kind of crazy talk is that? Would you mutilate someone because you saw her cut herself first and she seemed to enjoy it? Why anyone self-mutilates is more complicated than your observation that the