Bedroom
So, would you date a Bi guy?
by susan mernit

For someone like me, living in oh so open-minded Northern California, the tabloid press stories about celebrities’ sex lives are kinda puzzling. Every week, there’s a story outing some star’s sexual life:

“Gavin Rossdale’s ex-girlfriend is a man!”

“Lindsay Lohan is gay!”

“Will Smith is secret love of Tom Cruise—and his wife Jada’s on the down-lo!”

“Lady Gaga’s Poker Face is about how she really likes girls!”

Yeah, right.

Is the Bay area the only place in the world where the idea someone might be bisexual—rather than straight or gay—isn’t some super big deal?

Am I the only woman in North America who thinks that men who are open about their (occasional) interest in other men are appealing—and way hotter than fake bisexual Ms. Kate Perry (cover singer of “I kissed a girl,” the phoniest song on the planet)?

Apparently not.

Right now, despite the spate of racy headlines about Gavin Rossdale’s past with singer Marilyn, (cross-dressing, gender bending man/woman), male bisexualty is apparently cool—or at least flirting with it is.

In a recent piece at The Daily Beast, the wonderful Rachel Kramer Bussel writes about how the bisexually tinged “Bromance” is the new cool thing of the moment in celebrity land—or at least flirting with it is. While she recognizes a lot of the well-publicized chest bumping the fellas are engaging in is fake, she sez that doesn’t mean there isn’t something new happening.

Rachael says that a lot of the man-crushes are “faux”—no one’s getting truly sexual—but that the fact the straight male crowd can even just start to embrace their inner pansexual bi guy indicates some new hopes for the future. After all, when Jimmy Kimmel jokes “I Fucked Ben Afleck,” the world’s shifted, right?

Writing in Salon, Sarah Hepola echoes Kramer Bussel and adds that back in the day, male “slips in heterosexuality” were fodder for laughs, and notes that now the need to always define as straight has (somewhat) abated.

Says Hepola, “What was risky four years ago in "Brokeback Mountain" has almost become beside the point (not to mention award fodder) in movies like "Milk," so that James Franco can speak casually with "Fresh Air's Terry Gross about kissing Sean Penn, and it doesn't even generate headlines.”

And then of course, there are the “emo boy” Pete Wentz (married to Ashlee Simpson and father of a new baby) pix of the dude lip-locking with some other lip-liner-ed fella. That doesn’t seem to raise any eyebrows with anyone, does it?

So, ladies, here’s the deal--Is the question “Would you date a bi guy?” Or it is “Hey, why wouldn’t you?”
On the don’t go there side, there’s always the “What if he’s really gay?” thing.

After all, no one wants to be an unwitting beard, window dressing for the down lo. And anal sex is a high-risk practice that carries higher danger of AIDS transmission than many other things, so a girl’s gotta watch out.

On the other hand, if someone tells you’re they’re into guys—but they really like women, too, (or they like women, and an occasional guy), isn’t that kind of a comment about their flexibility and openness?

Are guys who are confident enough to admit they’re sometimes drawn to men potentially a lot more interesting? (And after all, practicing safe sex is common sense with anyone you sleep with, no matter the gender of his or her partners. And hey, herpes knows no bounds (just barriers).

So, ladies, what say you, in your dating life are the bi guys a yea, or a nay?

For my friend Lisa, the idea of a guy who plays with other men is repulsive. “I don't want someone who puts private parts in those places,” she says (a comment there is never an answer to). “It just turns me off.”

My friend Stephanie, on the other hand, looks out for the bi guys on Nerve and Okay Cupid and frequents bisexual meet ups as a way to seek out bi men. “I’m not so into women myself,” she says, “But I think bi guys are way more open minded.”

What do you mean? I ask.

“Oh, bi men who like women are adventurous,” she says. “And they’re better explorers, more interesting. They’ve worked the edges.” (Steph’s dated a gorgeous Irish scientist, a pagan poly programmer, and an emergency room physician since she began to focus on bi men, and each one of them has been fantastic in a lot of ways.)

I asked my friend Jediah, a married guy who identifies as polyamorous and bisexual what he thought about Steph’s comments.

“Well, isn’t everyone bisexual to some degree?” After all, there’s that Kinsey scale, “ he said. “Well, I think men who are bi-sensual, or bi-sexual may have dealt with all their feelings more, and have experienced gender in a more diverse way. That, in turn, may make them somewhat different that the “typical” guy.”

In my own life, I give men who self-identify as bi extra kudos.

It’s not a requirement for dating, it’s a nice to have, and it comes with my assumptions bi men will be more comfortable talking about gender and sexuality as fluid, and that they won’t just assume that male hetro-normative privilege thing automatically.

But most of all, I value men who identify as bi because they exemplify something I believe in and practice myself: you fall in love with the person, not the gender.

Do we really love people because they are male, or female, or because of who they are? And don’t we often love people because of the mix of masculine and feminine traits we see in them, regardless of what sex they were born?

In other words, aren’t sexual identity and gender actually choices we make and are really somewhat to fairly fluid?

I don’t think there are that many people in the world that believe that because Gavin Rossdale had a relationship with Marilyn, a trans-sexual singer, he doesn’t have a good relationship with Gwen Stefani, his wife. And it seemed pretty clear to everyone that when Lindsay Lohan fell for Samantha Ronson, she was drawn to the person, not the gender.

So, what’s the deal, yo? Would you date a bi guy? Yes—or no? Share in the comments, please.

Around the blogosphere:

Rachel Kramer Bussel, How Male Bisexuality Got Cool:

"Somewhat surprisingly, women, too, are increasingly open to dating—and are sometimes specifically attracted to—bisexual guys. In December, blogger Jocelyn Nubel wrote about dating a bi guy: “To be honest, I’d never before considered it a turn-on to picture a guy I’m into making out with another guy, but there’s just something about this one. He gets me so worked up, so sexually excited, and I guarantee if I saw that in action, it’d get me all hot and bothered.” That’s a far cry from Carrie Bradshaw’s reaction to the bisexual man she dated in an episode of Sex and the City nine years ago. In that episode, she goes to a spin-the-bottle party with him as the token straight girl, and even makes out with Alanis Morissette, but only so as not to seem like an “old fart.” Throughout the episode, Carrie and her friends make it clear that she finds the world of bisexual men to be disorienting and unreal. “I was Alice in Confused Sexual Orientation Land,” she muses, ultimately deciding she just can’t date someone who can’t pick a side."

Violet Blue: Does bisexual fakery ruin it for the rest of us?

"Straight people think girls are "experimenting" and it's acceptable. When they grow up to be women and declare their real, true bisexuality everyone gets all uncomfortable and wishes they'd just hurry up and choose a side already. Lesbians call them traitors or want to convert or bag them (trust me on this one), while straight dudes think it's hot as long as he's not threatened he's going to be replaced by a woman with masculine traits.

Meanwhile, men who state their sexual orientation as bisexual are pretty much either totally invisible (they might as well be unicorns)."

Feministing community: After Ellen's "The Trouble with 'Bisexual'" and why I am not a Cheeto:"

"Bisexuals are not Cheetos. We don't come with an expiration date. It's not like we go bad if we are not used in a timely fashion. I don't know where this idea came from, which I often see banded around in the lesbian and gay portions of our community, that if you haven't been actively dating both sexes concurrently and very currently, we are not really bi.”

 

Submitted by susan mernit (view blog) on Sat, 04/25/2009 - 7:21am
Posted In

Comments

 

Yes, Definitely

I would date a bi guy -- and have. I agree, it's a major "nice to have."

One of the major reasons, for me, is that people who are confident in and positive about their sexuality enough to be willing to embrace and explore definitions that go beyond the major societal defaults of "straight" or "gay" tend to be far more physically, emotionally, and relationally aware. They also tend to make fewer assumptions, and they're more willing to consider issues, explore, and talk things through rather than resort to reflexive reactions.

That's really nice in -- and out -- of bed.

I think being bi is much harder for guys to be be open about in our society than for women. When you've got a foot in the straight world and gay world, you're often not completely welcome in either, so you need to have a strong sense of personal balance and integrity to pull it off. Bi guys tend not to be wimps or bullies, consequently. Another bonus.

Oh, and let's not forget: Guys getting it on can be really hot to watch --or participate in. Yeah, there's that :-)

- Amy Gahran

 

 

Amy Gahran

Editor, Poynter's E-Media Tidbits

Contentious

Submitted by agahran on Sat, 04/25/2009 - 07:37
 

I have and probably will again, but...

My bi friend told me that intercourse was about tenth on his favorite things to do. I have dated other bi men who love it, but not this one. After two unsatisfying sexual encounters where he wanted me to do him with a strap on, I wrote him this letter from which I quote:

"I have been giving it some thought and have come to the conclusion we want different things. Or rather we want the same thing. You want to be penetrated by a dick and so do I. I am not good at playing the man. I want to be penetrated and so do you. I want lots of hard pounding from a hard man."

So would I date a bisexual man? Given that we enjoy each other and use the same sexual safety precautions I would use with a straight man, yes.

Submitted by CEEBEE on Sun, 04/26/2009 - 08:42
 

Danger, Danger

Nettalyce

 

As a former practitioner treating women of color coping with HIV/AIDS I find this topic rather disturbing.  It would be nice to live in an idealistic world where men who are bisexual always self disclose and always practive safe sex but unfortunately the continuing increase in HIV infection rates suggest otherwise.  It unforutnately is different for bixesual women as opposed to men.  Bisexual women don't contribute to the rate of HIV.  We all know that women are infected with HIV at a much higher rates  through vaginal intercourse than men.  So given that this is a blog is a cite dedicated to women it is highly irresponsible to promote the exploration of relationships with bisexual men.  We don't live in utopia, sexually transmitted diseases exist and the deadlier ones have a much greater impact on women than men.  So I am all for exploration of new innovative ideas and experiences but I would have to say that pursuing relationships with bisexual men is one frontier we should all avoid like the plague.  Now as for men on the down under, that's a whole other topic. 

Submitted by nettalyce on Sun, 04/26/2009 - 08:40
 

Safer sex is always a good idea

Hey Nettalyce, I disagree with you here - and think that by your logic no one should be dating men at all. Actually, there are a lot of points mixed up in your comment that I feel should be debunked.

I don't think it's irresponsible to talk about relationships with bisexual men.  I do tend to assume most women these days would opt for using condoms, and safer sex of whatever variety, in their dating relationships.  

And also, I think there is an assumption that a bisexual man would be sleeping with men at the same time as dating a woman and that is not necessarily true. Why would that even be an assumption in this case?  If people want to assure themselves of hiv status and they're monogamous then they can go and get tested and wait 6 months and get tested again. Same as a hetero couple might. And if people are still dating others or might be, go the safer sex route.

And, what do you think gay men are supposed to do, just not date other men? LOL. Anyway.

 

-----------------
Liz Henry
lizzard@bookmaniac.net
Contributing Editor, World and Latin America

Submitted by Liz Henry on Mon, 04/27/2009 - 14:27
 

I'm offended

I am very offended by Nettalyce's suggestion that women should not date bisexual men because of the risk of HIV, and even more offended by the statement that it is highly irresponsible to suggest otherwise. 

It is one thing to promote chastity as a safe sex strategy, and while I don't think promoting chastity does much to reduce infection, it is an effective strategy to follow if you like being celibate.  But the more effective  approach is to promote condom use. 

Telling people that it's only OK to love straight men who don't have sex with other men is not only ineffective, it is bigoted.  I am not saying that nettalyce is a bigot, just that the position that she takes is homophobic.  It is not homophobic to choose not to date bisexual guys, but it is homophobic to advocate that other women follow your own preferences, which would result in bisexual guys being isolated from women.

I think the best strategy for everyone is to acknowledge that you are taking a risk, and to determine whether it is an acceptable risk based on your partner's activities, most recent STD test results, and sex history, and also, to reduce the risk by using barriers.

Not sure what Australian men have to do with this, though...

Submitted by Steamwater on Tue, 04/28/2009 - 11:34
 

Theoretically speaking

@Nettalyce pointed out the fear that underlies a lot of apprehension towards women dating bisexual men. Basically, society doesn't really expect men to be faithful to their female partners (you know men, being men and needing to spread all that good seed around). But to open up new territory - you don't just have to sleep with women, you can sleep with men too. Chaos is suppose to ensue as these men wouldn't be able to keep their pants up for more than an hour a day. I'm exaggerating, but only a little, because I believe these fears are real. Who can you really trust in a relationship? But let's be honest, that in today's world, you should be protecting yourself regardless of who you are sleeping with claims that they are sleeping with - safe is a relative term.

 N.E. Way I would say that I could date a bi guy. I would say it, but I don't know if I would follow through on it. You didn't think this post was just about other people's fears did you?

Submitted by Kjen on Sun, 04/26/2009 - 10:09
 

"Date a bi guy". It sounds so 50's to me. :D

I don't think there's any more bisexual behavior in Hollywood (or on Main Street) than there ever was. I've never 'dated a bi guy' (sorry, it's LOL) but, back in the day, anyone with liberal politics of any kind was "bi", "bi-curious", "ambi-sexual" and most of them talked a good game of polyamory, and everyone 'hooked up' like bunnies in April. Including me. "Dating' wasn't the issue.  It would have been very bad manners not to share a bed (at the very least) with anyone who hitchhiked in for a rally. Those guys (sorry, fellas) weren't any more 'evolved' 'sensitive', 'hip', 'PC' or "feminist' than the other ones (although I'd have SWORN to you on a stack of Ms magazine they were) and by now they've all settled into whatever they're settled into, which is indistinguishable from what the 'uncool' guys sitting next to me in Algebra are doing now.

nettalyce is right, bi men DID do a lot to spread sexually transmitted diseases among women, and being all uptight about "not being prejudiced" when she points that out ain't science. Of course, if you want to generalize that one might logically say messing with men is dangerous, I can live with that, too. :D People can, and do, blame their failure to be honest about their sexual behaviors on "fear of homophobia" and Carrie Bradshaw is a fictional character .

It'd be swell, if there was ANY WAY AT ALL to identify good partners by their tag, but there isn't. So saying 'Yeah, I'd date bi men, 'cause they kewl.' or ' Heck, no. those parts is extra germy' is equally unfounded in reality. Why would that be any more 'advanced' an idea than saying, 'I just dig Latin men' or 'No fat chicks'? It may be a preference, but it's not a statement.

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Tue, 04/28/2009 - 14:02
 

I admit I've had prejudices towards bi men

I never even realized I had those prejudices until I read this article.  I have thought of bi-men as being potentially more 'dangerous' to sleep with because of disease.  So thanks for making me aware of that - cause no, I've never experienced a bi-male before so my assumptions are ignorant.

I can definitely see how they would bring something to the table in terms of skill and depth of character...  Hmmmm.  Something else for this newly-divorced lady to consider out in the dating trenches.:)

 

Delaine Moore

www.iamdivorcednotdead.com

Because a woman's body never lies...

Submitted by Delaine Moore on Wed, 04/29/2009 - 11:57
 

Been there, done that.

If you'd asked before I was confronted with it, I would have said that I had no idea how I'd react or how I'd feel about it. And then it came up, so to speak, and I found that I really didn't care.

Ultimately, it turned out that his words about honesty and open communication were a complete total load of BS, but that turned me off losers, not bisexuals.

Liz Rizzo

I blog at Everyday Goddess.

Submitted by Liz Rizzo on Fri, 05/15/2009 - 16:08
 

popcorn anyone...

This comment is towards nettalyce.  I'm not bashing you however your writing is very unfactual.  Bi men are no more in danger of getting aids than a straight man.  I'm in the army and I hear stories from "straight" guys that would just make you want to vomit.  One guy I know slept with over 100 girls in korea and is now married to this really nice lady who has no idea...If she only knew. Don't be so ignorant I can go on and on with the stories but I'll spare you.  As far as I'm concerned your statement is demeaning and a load of BS.  Sorry God forgive it's the truth 

-*soldier85*-

Submitted by soldier85 on Fri, 05/15/2009 - 16:46
 

Bi men are statistically at much higher risk

everytime they're studied. Also, they have less consistant use of condoms during anal sex. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18408826

Straight men can get AIDS, sure.  And do. And spread it around. And a higher number of partners increases risk in all populations, for all kinds of STD's.  But it's not 'science" to say, "I know a hetero guy, he's a total dog, therefore hetero guys, as a group, are just as statistically at risk." Statistics are about groups.

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Fri, 05/15/2009 - 17:14
 

Compare

Now to be accurate there are alot more "straight" men in this world then "bi"  Do the math 

-*soldier85*-

Submitted by soldier85 on Fri, 05/15/2009 - 19:06
 

Which would mean, doing the math,

that if you slept with ALL the men in the world, your chances of getting disease from a heterosexual one would be greater than getting it from a bi-sexual one. @@

However, if you're choosing between an equal number of hetero and bisexual men (say, 16 of each) your chances of contracting a disease from the bisexual cohort is higher than your chance of contracting a disease from the heterosexual cohort.

Of course, when we start getting into higher numbers, the chance of contracting a sexually transmitted disease starts to approach certainty, and, at that point, it doesn't make any difference. :) 

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Fri, 05/15/2009 - 20:45
 

You still full of it..

Besides this post wasn't even about who would contract aids faster and you still don't have proof.  Its not a fact.  Of course when you seek such pittiful answeres on your "anti-homosexual" sites they try to say the worst and it's still just a fiction answere.  So that being said have you lined up 16 straight guys and 16 bi guys to test them for that kind of fact?  If you haven't then well your wrong. 

-*soldier85*-

Submitted by soldier85 on Sat, 05/16/2009 - 05:53
 

Try again.

As it happens, I was a Field Associate for the Gay Rights National Lobby, starting in 1980...before you were born, probably. At that time, the priority activity was getting funding for something we were referring to as "that gay cancer' because the HIV virus hadn't been discovered yet. I've been working on public health issues in the gay and woman's community ever since...also, facts don't scare me.  So after I finish laughing at your childish attack, I repeat, women can get STD's, including AIDS, from most sexual contacts, BUT bi-sexual men are particularly problematic, because, as a group, they engage in more high-risk behavior than other men who have sex with women. 

I like "anti-homosexual sites" for the National Institute of Health. :D 

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Sat, 05/16/2009 - 12:09
 

Statistics and Individuals

I understand, She Who, that you are not arguing that women should not date bi men; just citing statistics.  I have no problem with that.  The problem is when people make blanket statements about not dating men in a particular group because men in that group are statistically more likely to practice unsafe sex.  All that matters is the practices of the guy you're dating, not what other bi guys do.

Suggesting that women should not date bi men because they are statistically more likely to carry HIV is like saying that women should not date black men because they are statistically more likely to go to prison.  All that's really important is the character of the individual, not the statistics applicable to some group or other to which he or she belongs.

This has a lot to do with why I don't like accepting political, religious or sexual labels for myself. The label tends to cause others to assume things about other aspects of my character which may or may not apply to me.

Submitted by Steamwater on Tue, 05/19/2009 - 08:36
 

But the question is by category.

And it's dating, not hiring.  :) So people are permitted to use any (or no) criteria at all to make this determination.

I can say, "I'll only date left-handed guys with advanced degrees in Physics or Statistics" and that's that. If my personal criteria excludes a disproportunate amount of "persons with straight hair", "persons who are skilled trombonists" or "persons who wear New Balance sneakers" that doesn't make it equivalent to racism, or other forms of institutional prejudice. It's still a dating preference.

The very fact that we're discussing dating men is evidence that some categories are permitted to apply, and the discussion involves a lot of "evidence by category".  If "bi men are more sensitive" is in bounds, then "bi-men are more likely to spread AIDS" should be, no? They're both "evidence by category".

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Tue, 05/19/2009 - 11:08
 

Yes, it's absolutely fine to

Yes, it's absolutely fine to use any criteria for dating, even if it's completely arbitrary.  My gripe is not with people who don't want to date bi guys.  It is with those who argue that other women should not date bi guys, and particularly with those who argue that it is irresponsible to suggest that bi guys might be OK to date.

Submitted by Steamwater on Tue, 05/19/2009 - 11:21
 

See, part of it is whether you see

other people's choices as being your business, or not. I come and go with that.

On the one hand, my friend Carole had every right to marry Ed. On the other hand, as her friend, I was concerned that Ed was an abusive, insecure, SOB.

So for years I worked on a balance with Carole (and Ed). I mostly listened while she dealt with the consequences of being married to an aiSOB. I didn't pile on when she complained, so I didn't need to retract my statements when she reconsidered. Therefore, I was still in the loop when she finally decided to get out, and got. THEN I did my dancing.

So, if you were my buddy, and you said to me, "I'm madly in love with Justin...and, what do you know? He's bi!" I wouldn't start talkng about sexual practices and their safety (any more than I always do, lol). I'd listen to what you had to say about him, and let you work out the awesomeness or otherwise yourself.

But if someone asks me, "Should I seek out bi men (or aiSOB's) to date?" I'd say, "Here are the issues. Worth considering."

My friend Carole had 3 darling daughters with Ed. That's a big point in favor of marrying Ed. But as a role model for 3 daughters, he was a minus. Only Carole knows the tipping point for herself.

One thing I'm certain sure of, though. No one, whatever their gender, gender identity, or sexual preference, is entitled to be some woman's sexual or romantic partner.  Most people won't tell you that. But I'm telling you (collectively), you can be as picky with your heart and your body as ever you want to be, and  it's okay. Or, your tastes can be as wide as the sky...but you're entitled to have them be your tastes.

That's a good thing to know, I think. :)

http://www.blogher.com/blog/she-who

Submitted by She Who on Tue, 05/19/2009 - 12:58
 

hmm

 The greatest ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about”

-*soldier85*-

Submitted by soldier85 on Sat, 05/16/2009 - 05:57
 

No I wouldn't date a Bi man.

I just don't feel like competiting with other men for the affection of my boyfriend. 

Submitted by kdmohn on Mon, 05/18/2009 - 09:22
 

i ve been there, but now i can see the ugly
truth- keep you safe

well, every girl who has not undergone a risk of getting the hiv ,  can be excited with the idea of dating a bi, because a bisexual person can understand your feelings and needs better than a straight. they can be romantic and very tender.

BUT heterosexual women consist a rising group of hiv positive people which is growing with fast rythm. It is terrifying. every 6 seconds a person gets infected with HIV. 8.000 people die daily

girls keep your eyes open, it was the most horrifing period of my life after falling in love with a bisexual person, we had some sexual intercourse and then... i did not know if i was -having hiv- or healthy.. thanks god i was lucky and after having a lot of tests now i m safe and i ll never put my life in danger again.  i changed as a person since this thing happened...

a lot of people get through the same procedure that i did, some are lucky and some are not.  even if you use a condom with a bi, it could just break. and hiv is also transmitted through mouth. so try to keep yourself safe-alive by dating only straight men.

HELP STOP AIDS. always use a condom. there is no cure, there is only prevention.

check the videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRqXcXolCEs&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3S8hJUyuc8&feature=related

i say all these with love to people generally

Submitted by violetta on Mon, 11/16/2009 - 09:13