White Swim Club Invites Black and Hispanic Children Back But Parents Say Lawsuit

I think it's terribly sad that these segregated places still exist. I don't know if I would want a Black child in this pool. It seems to me they would be bullied by the White children and emotionally hurt as well by the White parents. I would prefer a Black child to be in a multicultural atmosphere where the White people there will accept him for who he is. However, at the same time what these White people are doing is terribly wrong.

something - racial prejudice is so wide spread because it is almost always visible physically. We can see it and react according to how we have been taught/conditioned. But there are so many other prejudices as well - religious, social, behavioural.......which are not visible by sight but nevertheless exist. Because something is not visible to the eye, does it mean that it is less significant.

Only when we learn to respect ourselves as human beings first and then as white black christian muslim educated illiterate wealthy poor etc can we rise above all this. Otherwise we are just like lemmings.

I think I am sounding very pessimistic but that is not my intention. I am trying to be diapassionate.

What do you think? 

I don't know how the people at the pool would react to Sasha and Malia if they weren't identified as the president's daughters. That's the thing about racism, even influential people have had their "crash" moments when they discover the only thing a person sees is the color of their skin.

I do know, however, that Sasha and Malia are not above attacks by racists as evidenced in this post at Womanist Musings, "Malia called a typical street whore at the Free Republic. ( http://www.womanist-musings.com/2009/07/malia-call... )" 

Neither do we know how the people at VCS would have reacted if it had been one black child as opposed to 65 black and Hispanic kids. Fear of the "other" horde is also at play here.  I've heard black people from small towns where their family was the only black family say they were never aware of racism.   Throw 10 black families into the same environment and people start screaming that their way of life is being threated. 

Nordette Adams ( http://www.bookotopia.com ) is a BlogHer CE ( http://www.blogher.com/haystackprofile/viewprofile... ) & you can find her other stuff through Her 411 ( http://her411.com ).

unwelcome too?

It is not a question of racism but of hypocrisy. I bet the members will bend backwards literally to allow children of influential people into the pool, be they of any race.

Not only children but adults also stay away from this kind of confrontation. And in my opinion it is ok.

Why waste energy on these things when there are bigger issues to be dealt with. Anyone starting an all black-only swimming pool? 

I totally did assume that.  Partly because there probably are far fewer white people doing exactly that.  Or that is my predjudice, I suppose. 

Do you assume that the following sentence applies only to whites?

The best thing, however, is for people who are the same ethnically to confront those within their own groups about their racism.  

I think if all groups confront their own members about bigotry toward other groups the result be more effort to interact with those outside the group.  

Nordette Adams ( http://www.bookotopia.com ) is a BlogHer CE ( http://www.blogher.com/haystackprofile/viewprofile... ) & you can find her other stuff through Her 411 ( http://her411.com ).

I agree that you cannot force people to accept you.  And I agree that sending a child into such a hostile environment - I dont know if I could do it either.   Besides the fact that it wont do any good.

But its not always as cut and dried as that - forcing vs staying away.  And the fool proof way of ensuring that the next generation of young white people grow up as narrow minded as their parents, is to reduce the possiblity for none forced interaction.  Accidental games next to the pool.  Shared books in the library. 

I dont agree that the only solution is for people within that ethnic group to speak up. 

 That is certainly a powerful way to go, and we all have that duty.  But so do we all, on both sides. 

I live in a country that has undergone massive change in its racial setup.  And things are still bad over here.  

But I know many white people who have changed in their hearts. Most of them are old.  And you know what - in all cases it came about because we no longer have seperate entrances to the post office. We have to share the same public transport.  We have to live closely together with people of different races.  Forced interaction, if you like.  And personal, friendly interaction with people different from you is the only way to learn that you know what - they are actually not that different from you in the ways that count.

Forced interaction wont work. But any interaction is going to seem forced to people who just simply dont want to interact at all. And is that OK?

You are correct, it's not the same as sending a child to a school during the struggle for desegregation, but I think that some people still think that when a group won't associate with you, you should force the issue in the name of equality. 

There's one mother who still wants to send her child back to Valley Swim and that's the only reason I can think of that she might do that. I suspect she wants to force acceptance or maybe she thinks her child will learn by going back to the exact same pool that the people had no right to put the children out.

I don't believe you can force acceptance at a private white club in the suburbs. Some of the people moved there in the first place because they didn't want to see black faces and didn't want their children associating with urban minority children.

I think it's right to sue for damages because "when money talks, nobody walks." I believe in the lawsuit as the price Valley Swim club members must pay to be jackasses, but I don't think black people should start sending their children to Valley Swim Club and paying swim fees to the club.

Nordette Adams ( http://www.bookotopia.com ) is a BlogHer CE ( http://www.blogher.com/haystackprofile/viewprofile... ) & you can find her other stuff through Her 411 ( http://her411.com ).

Public outcry. Lawsuit. And if anyone is brave enough to send their kids back after the lawsuit, assuming the campers prevail in court, they can do that. I wouldn't do it, put a child through it unless I had psychologically prepared the child and they understood it was now bigger than swimming. But I would send some adults to swim.

I think that we have black parents in America now who attended schools in the 60s and 70s and even 80s who have painful memories of being children and being rejected because of skin color in environments that children should associate with good times. They want to protect their own children from that pain and so would just as soon keep them away from bigots than expose their children to them to make a point.

In the long run, it won't do anyone any good if this becomes a norm, people showing their true racist colors and as a result the other group backs down.  The best thing, however, is for people who are the same ethnically to confront those within their own groups about their racism. 

As far as VSC goes, I think that if black people started showing up regularly, its membership will split, and the people who don't want to be around black or Hispanic people will start a new private club or start swimming only at each other's homes. You can't force people to accept you. 

Nordette Adams ( http://www.bookotopia.com ) is a BlogHer CE ( http://www.blogher.com/haystackprofile/viewprofile... ) & you can find her other stuff through Her 411 ( http://her411.com ).

OK - I know that things are very different where I live.  Black people are in a majority here, and in the USA that is not the case.  But I think it is wrong to give up on the ideal of ending discrimination based on race.

And that is not at all the same as saying that all people must hang out together, regardless of race, or denying that people like to socialise with other people with whom they have something in common.  Like race, for example.

Of course they do.

But that is very different from saying that its OK to be rude to an outsider entering your space.  Or that a business can make rules discriminating on the basis of race, gender, etc.

Its not OK. We still have the duty to treat others with dignity.

Unfortunately in our society (and I mean the whole world, not just my country) the history has been that certain factors define you more than others.  In other words, you are defined mostly by your race, class or gender.

But what if that pool could be a space where people who love swimming can be hang out together - the most important thing they have in common being their love for swimming?

If this is not possible, are we going to create separate libraries, clubs and schools so that this natural inclination to be only with people of the same race can be satisfied?

I will tell you something.  We have tried that over here. It was called apartheid and it does not work.  What happens is, the richer people get the better facilities.  People who don't fit neatly into racial or class categories, get shafted.  Ugly things happen.

There just is no easy way out of this.  And yes, it will mean children being exposed to hurtful experiences. But do you truely believe the alternative is even possible?

This was not an attempt to integrate a facility.  I just do not see this situation in that same light.

When we began to integrate it was understood that the public facilities were closed to us. It was not a hidden fact. It was well known and widely accepted.  Opening up accessibility was based on that fact.

This incident began as a basic capitalist exchange within the republic.  Even though it was an all White facility once the fee was accepted by the club execs-there was no reason to think race would be a factor.

To wait until the children arrived to deny them access was sincerely stupid on the admin staffer's part.  Even if the other patrons of the pool were uncomfortable with the ethnic background of the children-admittance should of proceeded as the parties agreed upon.  Even if the other pool patrons vacated the facility for the day. This is just good business in my mind. 

If the admin staff knew that the children's ethnic/socio/economic background was going to be problem-nothing was done prior to their arrival to prepare the other patrons.  Cultural sensitivity training is not a new thing. 

 I cannot be supportive of giving money to an organization that discriminates and does shoddy business at the same time.  That is not a lesson we learned during the movement.  This is America. Money talks and bulls*** walks. 

It seems to me that the outcome is going to be more costly than the fee. Which would lead me to question why the staff is still drawing a check from Human Resources? Their lack of common sense in the decision making and practices is less than acceptable.